USA Sieger Show - Page 3

i am told that this year SS was typical of years past but what would you expect when the organization sells out to bring the same contoversial judges over time and again? I am told that Dux was in his usual form and of course the VA dogs were somewhat predictable.
But after looking at the SS show placements and reading posts from various other messageboards, I do have a few questions.for the more kowledgeable and experienced posters on here.  i would like to know how/why:
There were 11 VA males out of less than 50 male in the Working Dog Class. WOW. What quality according to our judge. I then started looking at other statistics and wondered what this meant. Does these placements mean that we in the US have better dogs in perportion to entry than the dogs shown in Germany?
How many German Breeders are using US VA dogs in their breeding programs?
Why are people in the US buying dogs out of Germany if the superior per ratio dogs are from and in the US?
just some of my stats:
2007 German Sieger Show had 8 VA males, 156 V males and 4 SG males out of over 200 entries.
2006 German Sieger Show had 8 VA males,  138 V males and 2 SG males out of over 200 entries.
2005 German Sieger Show had 9 VA males, 150 V males and again over 200 entries.
2004 German Sieger Show had 9 VA males, 150 V males, 6 SG males and again over 200 entries.
Thoughts and opinions appreciated.
Chuck
I 

"Sometimes you have to trust that the judge sees better than you do" ?! Last I checked I wasn't clinically blind!  I can see, quite clearly, when a dog's grip is so loose its barely hanging on with one side his canines, I can see when bitch flinches when a stick is raised. I can see perfectly fine when a dog tiptoes up to the helper. What planet do you live on? If you think every dog who passed deserved it, you need to see some truly strong, well trained dogs work.

There were a few good dogs, but they were vastly outnumbered by the mediocre ones. And of course most of the best wokring dogs went mid-field at best.  Intro Bullinger, who I believe won one of the protection tests awards, only went V19. (I think) I think he was a beautiful dog with a lovely topline, high wither but with a correct, straight back.  The placements of the other better working males were equally disappointing to me.

Chuck, I agree with you on the number of VAs. I've been complaining about it for some years. If a dog can't go VA in Germany, it shouldn't go VA in this country or anywhere else. How or why? Two answers. $$$$ and $$$$.

I did not stay Saturady long enough to watch the youth/young dog classes. After being drenched and depressed, I went home. I will say did not care for the toplines of MANY MANY puppies on Friday. I saw a lot of beautiful color and big teddy bear heads, but a lot of roached backs and loose hocks.  This of course can change in a puppy. I used to go to a SS and see a lot of dogs I liked, now I find very few. Perhaps my tastes are just changing. Not so dazzled by just a dark red flashy mover anymore.

From where you sat, what looked fine, the ring work or the performance test?

That was a joke. I wasn't there this time.

SS

Shelly:
I do not think people on this board have much in the way of a scense of humor!  Heck, I went through my entire repitore of singing in the rain songs, including "I Love a Rainy Night" and no one would join in at the show

Wish that shepherd people had the temperments of their dogs, so many are just too sharp, civil and dirty bitters.  Definatly just need to stick to the dogs for freindship and fun!

So above and beyond all the pissing and mouning how was the judge's greet night and the banquet? In the past these events have not rated very good but this year the organization was going to tie in raffle prizes and lots of other stuff. How did these events go?
Chuck

GSD4dogs, this post is for you.

You quoted me below:

based on what I saw on video from last year and what I saw live this year, unfortunately NOTHING has changed as far as how the dogs are being judged.


Not a good idea to compare live and video.  You say this is your first Seiger show, yet you are comparing this year and last.

I guess we all have an opinion.  I have some complaints about the performance of some of the humans but, in my opinion the dogs all went above and beyond.

Some failed and that is always sad to see but I did not see any who passed who shouldn't have.  Sometimes you have to trust that the judge sees better than we do.


Well, considering some us of cannot travel accross country to view every sieger show, why not compare video to live performance??? Why is that an issue?? So far, unless a video is edited and replaced with another dog....video's don't lie... I would really appreciate it if you would address that comment. 

Yes, I am owining up to the fact that this is my first  LIVE Sieger Show. Are you trying to discredit me for saying that??. Actually, I think many a newbie may find my  perspective a bit interesting.

What in the world do human performances have to do with dogs

Below is a quote from a previous post of yours GSD4dogs......

"But I have no experience with Schutzhund or protection work"

BTW- Found the above quote from one of your previous posts quite amusing.

Since the above comment is yours from a previous post, perhaps you should refrain before commenting from any protection work regarding the Sieger Show.

 

Chris,

Was not trying to discredit anyone, just saying video is not the same as in person and for that matter my viewpoint is not the same as yours.

As far as comparing video to in person...lot's of difference. I served on a jury once where the entire act was on video. Both sides showed us that video at nauseum during the trial. when it came time to deliberate, all 12 jurors had totally different points of view about what we saw on that video.

"But I have no experience with Schutzhund or protection work"

I did not make the above statement in any post on this database.  Maybe you can tell where and when you took that quote from?

I do have experience with Schutzhund and protection work.  I have also attended 5 WDA and 2 USCA and I German Sieger Shows and countless trials.

I will stand by my opinion as I am assuming you will stand by yours.  But please do not attribute statements to me that I never made.

Irene