Follow on to why do the breed them like this - Page 5

Liz, I've brought Bob v Patriot to the top again (ever hopefull) so that Gustav, should he be interested, can see what we like................ and what I would like very much to have... PLEASE!

Yes i have left a comment, but can't access his page for some reason,he is sooooo stunning i just wanted another look. liz

This is my last post on this, Missbeeb, Chisum and Funky Munkey, if your dogs come from years and years of working livestock, then the comments I have made about worried look in eyes and incorrect anatomy to actually work wouldn't apply to the dogs you have. I don't care what color a dog is as long as it represents the breed "in Word and Picture" So therefore the nasty diatribes toward me and my comments should not have directed as these type of dogs were not the type I was referencing. Now whether your dogs are the norm in showlines, I can't say, but I can say that I have seen to many dogs of certain type that could'nt work livestock or anystock because of lack of confidence and nerve. So why people would torch me and question my knowledge of the breed when what I am identifying is commonly known throughout the world, and they don't have these type of dogs is beyond me. But facts are facts, rather you ask people like Dr. Mesbler(sp), former SV pres who tried to fix it, or the creation of SV 2000 which is a result of it, or the performances at the seiger show, that really don't represent the standard in the performance aspect, or a time when the showring did have dogs that were strong, clearheaded, and noble, ...IT IS WHAT IT IS!! This isn't Gustav's issue this is an issue that is THERE!  Take care folks !

Gustav, OK... it was hardly a diatribe, but I was rude..... sorry!

I got heated (very) because we always get the wl guys having a go, but ours don't walk on their hocks blah blah blah.  We don't want them anymore than you but neither do we want terrier fronted, square looking dogs with no hind angulation and weak heads.

Please look at Bob v Patriot... he's what we like... what I want, very badly!

"See" you around I hope?

I have just as much problem with WL that have more drive than brains and require an experienced handler to train or manage them....that's not GS temperament either and provides a disservice to the breed in the long run.

I was also going to stay out of this never ending subject, but just have to say that I agree totally with Gustav's last post.

I trained SchH for 22 years (1971-1993) I always went with the working lines. Infact it wasn't just working lines that were good enough back then, they also had to be super hard dogs to be respected as well.  Many a day did I arrive at the club only to witness a full out battle between handler and dog.  Then in the 80's they had to be bouncing off the walls with drive and energy to really be good.  Hyper may very well have described a lot of them. Very few of these dogs would have ever made a good family pet or anything that could have been trusted around livestock...or even a pleasure to be around.  These type of dogs are very difficult as well.   I personally think it's good to have a mix of temperments to pick from.  I think it's okay to have some softer type dogs(from SL's) to choose from as long as they are still sound of mind and capable of getting a title...I don't see a problem with that.  Having said that, in no way do I mean fear biters or mental unsoundness issues.  Not eveyone wants or needs to compete on the SchH field at the upper levels.  As long as there are stingent guidelines in which all breeeders follow. then I don't think we have a lot to argue about.  We can't or don't all want the samething in our dogs.

misbeeb, I looked at Bob vom Patriot, and he is a pretty nice looking pup, but a bit hard to judge just how he'll look as an adult from that picture, so I took a peek at his ancestors.

This one just about knocked me off my chair! If he were available here as a sire, I'd book my bitch a date with him right now!

To me, that's what a GSD should look like. His back could be a tad shorter, but I love everything else about him. (Yes, I'd have to assess his temperment and movement, to get the total picture, but other than that...WOW!)

He looks quite a bit like Bodo/Berndt, doesn't he?

V Falk von den Wölfen, SCHH3 IP3 ( 3 X SG-BSP ) Kkl 1

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/123666.html

I think that falk is way too long, in a long run it might cause back problems, especialy if you would to work that dog extensively. But good looking dog. I think this i where my bitch is heading, I just hope that she won't be that long, but if she will oh well. :) Good looking dog btw.

chicki, pretty much... ditto!

Sunsilver,  Glad you like him........ I wish he were mine!  There is a little video of him on u tube, the link to which is on the vom Patriot website.  You'll be able to see that his back is not too long atall... not that I'm bias!