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by mahon on 12 March 2009 - 17:03
Mystere and 4pack ,
When I first came to this board that is what I hoped it would be. I am sure that some are looking at this and saying what a dumb a__ __! But the way I see it is it took 46 years for me to see puppies like this and I am certain others have seen the same. The only difference was they destroyed them and sold the littermates without disclosing the recessive pups that were born. Honest is the eassiest thing to be. It takes no thought or work to keep it straight in your head and it does not come back to BITE YOU ! Let's all hope others will follow. If you want a courageous dog with a sound mind and sound body that is what should be most important, not color. I have seen plenty of spooks and alligators that had the right color. Just dont make it a point to sell recessive colored pups for breeding and disclose to the buyers the whole litter, good bad and indifferent. They can make an informed descision as to if they want to buy or pass on a puppy from that litter.
That's the way it should be.
Just my thoughts, mahon
When I first came to this board that is what I hoped it would be. I am sure that some are looking at this and saying what a dumb a__ __! But the way I see it is it took 46 years for me to see puppies like this and I am certain others have seen the same. The only difference was they destroyed them and sold the littermates without disclosing the recessive pups that were born. Honest is the eassiest thing to be. It takes no thought or work to keep it straight in your head and it does not come back to BITE YOU ! Let's all hope others will follow. If you want a courageous dog with a sound mind and sound body that is what should be most important, not color. I have seen plenty of spooks and alligators that had the right color. Just dont make it a point to sell recessive colored pups for breeding and disclose to the buyers the whole litter, good bad and indifferent. They can make an informed descision as to if they want to buy or pass on a puppy from that litter.
That's the way it should be.
Just my thoughts, mahon
by 4pack on 12 March 2009 - 18:03
I agree, no one benefits from info withheld.
by Mystere on 12 March 2009 - 19:03
Ditto. Furthermore, I have always maintained that if a blue or liver puppy in a litter I was interested in turned out to be the one that showed me it was what I was looking for, I'd still be inclined to take, train and title that puppy. I simply would never breed it...and probably would be wary of breeding to or from littermates.
This all explains a beautiful "Irish setter red" gsd bitch I saw the first time I went out to a schutzhund club. That bitch had the most wonderful temperament. After working in protection, she was loose, playing with a bumper and keeping an eye on the 2 or 3 yo and infant kids of the helper. I was standing and watching. The baby started crying and the bitch trotted over. I realized that there was no way I could get to my car, so I stood still and hoped for the best. She dropped her bumper and went to the baby, sniffed and checked her over. She then went over to the older boy and gave him a once-over. Then, she looked at me. Went back and picked up her bumper. She planted herself, with bumper, between me and the kids. I was really impressed.
Later, and for a couple of years, I was always puzzled when I asked the guy who had owned the bitch about her. He always played dumb and acted like he had no clue what I was talking about. I learned later that he was only with that club because his home club had suspended him for his breeding practices. Now, I wonder if breeding livers was among them, as it took years for me to realize that the gsd whose color I had never seen before of since was a liver sable. She was probably from working lines, but, due to his playing stupid, I have no clue who was behind her and therefore may be carrying that color.
This all explains a beautiful "Irish setter red" gsd bitch I saw the first time I went out to a schutzhund club. That bitch had the most wonderful temperament. After working in protection, she was loose, playing with a bumper and keeping an eye on the 2 or 3 yo and infant kids of the helper. I was standing and watching. The baby started crying and the bitch trotted over. I realized that there was no way I could get to my car, so I stood still and hoped for the best. She dropped her bumper and went to the baby, sniffed and checked her over. She then went over to the older boy and gave him a once-over. Then, she looked at me. Went back and picked up her bumper. She planted herself, with bumper, between me and the kids. I was really impressed.
Later, and for a couple of years, I was always puzzled when I asked the guy who had owned the bitch about her. He always played dumb and acted like he had no clue what I was talking about. I learned later that he was only with that club because his home club had suspended him for his breeding practices. Now, I wonder if breeding livers was among them, as it took years for me to realize that the gsd whose color I had never seen before of since was a liver sable. She was probably from working lines, but, due to his playing stupid, I have no clue who was behind her and therefore may be carrying that color.
by mahon on 12 March 2009 - 22:03
I think you got it. Color is just that. "color"
You probably hit the nail on the head. You just realized after all those years what you really saw. This little liver sable is one tough and smart cookie. Very alert and always looking up.
I was very disapointed at first look of these two guys and now it's just their color, so be it. God made them that way for some reason. Who's to say if I bred the same parents 10 times that for sure they would ever throw another. Mathematically they should. Atleast produce 1 out of 4. However I do'nt plan to breed them together again.
Just my thoughts, mahon
You probably hit the nail on the head. You just realized after all those years what you really saw. This little liver sable is one tough and smart cookie. Very alert and always looking up.
I was very disapointed at first look of these two guys and now it's just their color, so be it. God made them that way for some reason. Who's to say if I bred the same parents 10 times that for sure they would ever throw another. Mathematically they should. Atleast produce 1 out of 4. However I do'nt plan to breed them together again.
Just my thoughts, mahon
by Q Man on 12 March 2009 - 22:03
I like that..."like a box of Choc o lates..."
by Kelly M Shaw on 13 March 2009 - 15:03
I have actually seen 1 liver puppy in my life time and 2 blue's as well. It is nice to see some honesty in the breeding world, and I applaud you for that!!! What ever color they are they look like a nice bunch of puppies you have there. I've always said honesty is the best policy, and it always pay's off in the long run. Kudos to you :-)
Kel
www.boeselagerkennel.com
Kel
www.boeselagerkennel.com
by mahon on 13 March 2009 - 19:03
Kelly M Shaw ,
It is what it is. People just might ought to just tell it like it is. None of us knows what the other breeders have had pop up over the years. If they dont disclose it. It will show up later. Eventually someone else will have it appear. I have had a few e-mails and pms. that have also seen the same thing. I will not disclose what they have said as they did not wish to post it on the board and I will respect that. So we all know it is out there and we will all stumble on it from time to time. Just next time it wont be such a surprise. I dont do this for a living anymore so it is a much easier descision for me then some I'm sure.
Ps.I like the dark black sable bitch you have on your home page. She looks like my Zidane daughter. The darker the better, I think.
Thanks, mahon
It is what it is. People just might ought to just tell it like it is. None of us knows what the other breeders have had pop up over the years. If they dont disclose it. It will show up later. Eventually someone else will have it appear. I have had a few e-mails and pms. that have also seen the same thing. I will not disclose what they have said as they did not wish to post it on the board and I will respect that. So we all know it is out there and we will all stumble on it from time to time. Just next time it wont be such a surprise. I dont do this for a living anymore so it is a much easier descision for me then some I'm sure.
Ps.I like the dark black sable bitch you have on your home page. She looks like my Zidane daughter. The darker the better, I think.
Thanks, mahon
by weissblau on 13 March 2009 - 23:03
Hi,
very interesting thank you for sharing. I had a litter once that came from the same lines as yours on the Dams side ( Wanko vom Lippischen Norden etc....)
I had sables in that Litter no color surprises.
very interesting thank you for sharing. I had a litter once that came from the same lines as yours on the Dams side ( Wanko vom Lippischen Norden etc....)
I had sables in that Litter no color surprises.
by Kelly M Shaw on 13 March 2009 - 23:03
mahon, I agree that we don't know how many are out there due to breeders (not everyone) keeping it to themselves, but yes it will eventually show up sooner or later. It's just always best to be honest about everything than for it to bite you in the behind down the road, JMHO.
Thanks for the nice comment on my female, much appreciated :-)
Kel
www.boeselagerkennel.com
Thanks for the nice comment on my female, much appreciated :-)
Kel
www.boeselagerkennel.com
by Xeph on 13 March 2009 - 23:03
Color be damned mahon, those little livers are CYOOT!
Your poor bitch is looking at you like "I didn't mean to make livers I SWEAR! ...but I luvs them"
It's disappointing that people would kill a puppy simply because it's a color. I can understand a color that is linked to serious health issues, but being liver or blue isn't a disease any more than my being black is a disease.
As long as they're happy, healthy, and have a good home to go to, they'll be alright ^_^
Your poor bitch is looking at you like "I didn't mean to make livers I SWEAR! ...but I luvs them"
It's disappointing that people would kill a puppy simply because it's a color. I can understand a color that is linked to serious health issues, but being liver or blue isn't a disease any more than my being black is a disease.
As long as they're happy, healthy, and have a good home to go to, they'll be alright ^_^
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