How would you improve the GSD of today? - Page 5

Not at all, Chris.

I would create an organization that would regulate breeders - make sure contracts are honored, publicly post health issues of progeny of sires and dams, enforce paperwork issues, make sure titles, show ratings and breed surveys are real and not "bought" (placing a stronger emphasis on the HOT aspect), and limit the amount of pups/litters that a breeder can produce or import in a year. Some "breeders" seem like really expensive mills - greed corrupts. People producing pups strictly for money will ruin the breed, even though they will insist that they have higher aspirations. Unfortunately, because there is not much regulation on breeders. People can almost get away with anything.

Jess, Long coat is a genetic defect (autosomal recessive) which makes the dog lack it's undercoat and therefore, not be able to tolerate rough weather. That goes against the original intentions of the founder of the breed (herding dogs need to live outside and be able to tolerate rough weather). But this applies only to the "true" long coat. I think this term is used somewhat loosely on some plush coats, which is not a genetic defect but just a variation in the spectrum of coats that this breed comes in. Other more experienced breeders can comment on that.

hey folks .. i liked this p[ost -- many of you all have great responses -- gee -- and i was diisappointed as to earlier this week why there were not a lot of comments on my suggestion that a GSD with more than 2 linebreedings in a 7 generation cannot be registered[or bred] .. mostly because the line breeding has ruined in my opinion the breed -- or hwat i want to state .. in muy defintion of breeds /genetics we have several so called german shepherd breeds -- first the american line GSD which opf course is generaly a disgrace ..has no roiginal structure or behavioral traits[ sorry for those that breed them -- you really are lacking knowledge and sadly .. don't even realize it ] , secodnly ther is the german showline vs the working line --in my opinion has just aboutcome to two diifernet breeds of canine -- first i would start 1. no seiger .. where there is a plave for someone to use the dog as en ego or commodity -- hey floks let's be truthful about human nature -- right there the dog is ruined -- there shopuld ,in my opinion be a shopw with this years best m 25 or so placements not to be palced again the next years -- now also a character and work test .. schutzhund .. a GSD.. that is a joke !! All dogs should be obedient .. the canine is it's nose .. so protection -- when you get into the show lines fog goodness sake most often all the dog has to do is display a bite and an out -- there is no real test there for the stress level of a dog -- goodness i have my pups jumping over throught tires , running through water , climbing stairs and garbage pailes , running over palstic bottles , all at 10 weeks for rag work -- and in schutzheund all they have to do is bite a sleeve -- what a joke !! So outcorss for good structue and great behaviiopral traits and stop this pretty boy/girl show bit -

I don't normally make comments/posts, but this is an interesting topic... I think breeders should really look at production statistics in terms of working ability and health. There are so many "types" of GSD in the breed in general, so the color, conformation, etc. really is a matter of personal preference... The problem is working ability and health, those are the main two issues that need to be dramatically improved in OUR breed... The only way to fix that is for breeders to stop being kennel blind and to choose the best possible combinations in terms of their breeding program. You can't put a minimum standard (as some have mentioned) of SchH2 or SchH3 for example, let's face it- the breeding standard by SV rules requires a SchH1 (and all that is entailed in the Körung), and today the SchH2 and 3 are not so much different than a SchH1... also, in terms of a minimum score point wise, that doesn't make sense either because the scores are really a reflection of a lot of factors- the Handling/Training/Judge/Venue/Politics, etc. etc., not to mention what happens on any given day of a trial. The Körung must be improved!! The Judging must be improved, and certainly the Helper work MUST be improved in trials and in Körungs! Without PROPER evaluation of the dogs nature, drives, character, nerve, soundness, etc. we are only looking at a *trained* program.. In my opinion the WUSV should implement a "Wesentest" AND "Körung" similar to the DMC (Deutsche Malinois Club)... There are countries like Sweden who have great programs in place as well - which test the dogs true "raw" temperament - not things that are trained for such as the SchH/IPO, or the current "Körung" in place by the SV. Let's face it, we have the technology, the means, and the advancements in terms of science will allow us to set standards and enforce them where it was not possible 20+ years ago... we have to be on the cutting edge!! I think breeders should use dogs from their own kennel within their breeding program, the best breeders of any breed and any species KNOW what they are producing! ...to be continued....

Part 2.... Another idea is to implement a policy that restricts dogs from being bred further if they have not met a minimum production record of let's say: Within 3 years of producing their first litter - 1) 70% Satisfactory hip certifications in ALL offspring (of sufficient age). 2) 50% of ALL offspring (of sufficient age) must be titled in an acceptable working test/trial evaluation. (i.e. any WORKING title approved by the VDH). 3) 25% of ALL offspring (of sufficient age) must have a minimum of KKL1 or KKL2 (Körung) (i.e. DNA, HD/ED normal, BH, AD, show rating of "G" minimum and minimum of SchH/IPO/VPG/BHP, etc. 1 title). **When a "breeder" is not able to achieve these standards within a matter of a set period of time, with a maximum of 5 females over a period of let's say 8 years, their breeding license is revoked and they are no longer eligible to breed GSD's! **When a male or female has not met these requirements they are eliminated from the genepool and are not allowed to be used for breeding regardless of VA Status, BSP, Nationals, or WUSV winner, etc. What will this do???? It will keep the owners of the big named, highly achieved dogs in terms of competitions (whether that be show or working competitions) on their toes... and they will be VERY skeptical of the qualities (health, temperament, and conformation) of the females who are bred to their dogs. That is for the popular studdog owners a VERY scary thought, but it is the way to go! Now, how will that affect breeders, and most importantly the GSD breed in general? Well, to start with, breeders will be more inclined to do research on what their lines will produce, and they will also keep puppies for themselves and WORK them to ensure their kennel/breeding license is not revoked, they will know what they are really producing because they have the pleasure of working their own dogs... and they will place their dogs with qualified homes who are going to work them... the breeders will also be VERY supportive of their puppies new owners in terms of encouraging them to come to dogclub, to train, etc.... which in turn is going to enhance our dogsport and the breed in general... It will weed out the breeders who only care about the $$$ and will promote all positive aspects of the breed we love! I'm sure there are a lot of things that can be done, which never will be done because the organizations that were origionally set up to protect the breed have turned their heads because of $$$ and because the problems are just too far gone, and out of control... I'm all for the good looks... Working ability and health (in "Show" and "Working" lines) should be OUR TOP PRIORITY! And in terms of "Linebreedings", that is the single most valuable tool in terms of genetics for recreating any desired (or undesired for that matter) trait... Linebreeding is good, and will ALWAYS be good in order to maintain consistency- when you linebreed on shit, you'll get shit, and when you linebreed on a solid, well established, and consistent bloodline you'll get that... That's a fact, it can be argued of course - but normally the people making those statements don't have a clue what they're talking about! (I don't want to offend anyone, but it had to be mentioned so that the inexperienced readers of these posts are aware that there are two sides to every statement made) David Kiewel

The reason I mentioned the above percentages is because that is an achievable and realisitc standard to set as a Phase 1 Improvement Plan. As a side note: To include breeding/production requirements that would also consider Police type programs is not an entirely accurate or subjective means to measure true temperament, character, drive thresholds, soundness of nerve, reactivity levels to stimuli, etc. because every Police K9 program varies to such an extreme that it would be nearly impossible to accurately monitor... I have seen dogs working as "certified" dual purpose patrol dogs that I would personally NEVER allow to be bred because they just don't have what it takes... Police dogs are no better than sport dogs in terms of *general* comparison, it comes down to the standards of the testing procedures behind a title or certification that really matters... not just the typical "My dog is a certified police dog, therefore he is better than a Schutzhund titled sport dog because he's working the streets" type of mentality. David Kiewel

Also, another requirement I would implement is that each Studdog male is restricted to a MAXIMUM of 10 breedings per year, until he has achieved my above outlined "3-Year" probation period. After the dog has proven himself as an asset in terms of production/progeny, he is allowed to be bred up to 20 times per year, as long as he continues to meet the minimum standards outlined above he is allowed to be bred up to 20 times per year- However, ALL of his offspring (of eligible age) MUST continue to meet the outlined Percentage Requirements - if he fails to meet these requirements his breeding status is revoked and he is no longer eligible for breeding. What are some of the other benefits this proposed program??? I think this will greately enhance the genepool, it will force breeders to consider alternatives to the "BIG NAME" winners of the BSZS, BSP, etc. Because once the meet the maximum number of breedings in any given year, they can't be bred further... It will eliminate *Over breeding* or outragous usage of young *unproven* studdogs from doing too much damage before they're properly screened for "production credibility". and ??????? Does this make sense to anyone else, or do you think I am just plain out and out crazy for thinking this way???

Hi everyone seems to have great ideas about improving the breed but most of the ideas require to much work that most people in the U.S. just will not do. so here is my solution just bring back the reed stick and the courage rating.

Hi everyone seems to have great ideas about improving the breed but most of the ideas require to much work that most people in the U.S. just will not do. so here is my solution just bring back the reed stick and the courage rating.