GSDCA Announcement - Page 3

I wish I could make that show, Richard. I'd love to see Nino. I hear only great things about him from everyone.

Helen is a good friend, we have co-owned dogs including our pride and joy Funny v AltenbergerLand.  I have one of her AKC CH's now. Helen sure does walk the walk; I can't keep up with her . Her dogs are her life literally.

Blitzen

                I truly wish them well and hope they succeed.

 Here is my issue, Do we conceder the IPO the epitome of the working titles? For me not on your life! So you could say I don,t even conform to the German Standard. I believe that IPO should be and is recognized as a sport title only . I don,t feel it carries the distinction of a breed worthiness test as it was supposed to be. Years of lowering the bar has left it a hollow shell of what was a test. I believe a dog should be tested. Drive,Heart,Courage, Agaility should all be tested for a breed dog that we should all be able to agree upon with out issue. 

Bob,

Lots of people will agree with what you say. Where's the harm in promoting IPO? It's at least something. We have USCA that currently is the leader in the IPO department. Good organization, run well. There's a choice between two organizations to be another. GSDCA and WDA. Given the current set of circumstances. Which organization is in the best position to promote all aspects of the breed?

Bob, I think you represent the hard line working  section of the breed and will probably never think anything that  the GSDCA does will ever be good enough to benefit the breed in any way. I understand that and I have a number of friends who think the same way.  Still, I think you could have some valuable input should you decide to offer it. This breed is so segmented - WL's vs Czech vs GSL vs ASL, etc  that it will be especially diffficult for the new working dog committee to get the majority of GSD owners and breeders heading in the same direction. But they need to keep trying  anyway

'a couple old men and a bunch of older ladies'.....

This is EXACTLY why the GSDCA is open to changing the way they do things. Their shows are becoming like old folks' conventions. No new blood is coming in, because people just aren't interested in paying big bucks to have a pro handler run their dog around in a circle for 10 minutes!

The AKC shows are dying, while the SV style shows are healthy and growing.

Another factor is (just the facts, ma'am!) the appearance of the AKC GSD. The weak, saggy hocks (see Linda Shaw's pictures of the CKC national for examples) make the dogs look crippled and unattractive to your average joe. Someone on the PDB once said they overheard a conversation between a young child and his mother at a show. He said "It's nice that they have these shows for the crippled dogs, but when do the OTHER dogs get shown?" 

Maybe this WILL happen: the AKC will adopt the FCI standard! And (I hope) the CKC will follow suit!. Need I repost what retired CKC judge Gordon Garrett posted on FB this week, suggesting this very thing? 

"Helen and Morton are not young kids anymore, new blood would be so valuable right now. United we stand, divided we fall."

That's exactly why Gordon has been pushing me to get more involved. But the politics is just sooo daunting! The largest GSD breeder in my area edited my post when I dared to post the URL of another kennel on his FB page. He had just purchased a dog from them, but did not want their name advertised on HIS FB.

The dog he purchased is !00% German blood, so it's not like this kennel is going to be any competition for him in the breed ring...   (He's planning to cross it with his American SL bitches.)

Blitzen

                   Let me be clear I have no problem with IPO I do it with my dogs, my dogs are titled and god help me I,ll have my first Handler Owner Trained and Bred  Male shown in Comformation and a kore report done this summer. I get that. It should be done. To me IPO highlites the abality of the trainer to train his dog in a very correct pattern of obedience, this is wonderful but my opinion is it falls well short of a breed test. The breed test is supposed to be the Sch(IPO) 1 after passing that then they are eligable to get the Con and Kore. One thing any orginization really needs to look at is what is being tested in the IPO 1 ? If we are truely honest what in the IPO 1 as tested now is a stressor to judge the dog ? Yes it shows basic obedience and a mild train abality of a pattern routine. 

 There are literally dozens of activiteis for a handler and dog to do as a team and I,m glad, not all dogs are working dogs but that should not stop any one from a wonderful activity with there dog. BUT a Schutzhund title should mean more,Abreed title should mean more, everyone wins is a title that I hate to hear it just not relaistic but that what it is coimg to.

Oh geez, SS, let's not get into another bashing of ASL's please. AKC entries in all breeds are down not because the dogs are worse, because there are fewer being bred due to many reasons, 4 times as many shows and less people interested in showing dogs in any venue.  It got worse when the US economy tanked. When did you attend you last AKC GSD specialty? I was at the National in October and saw quite a few people who were not ready to kick the bucket.  There are plenty of vital younger people who belong to the GSDCA. They need to have an incentive to get involved is all. That might be one of the agendas for the new working committee.

Bob, by the same token, I recently heard a GSD handler/breeder say that due to the decline in the number of dogs being shown in the AKC/CKC ring, just about ANY GSD can get its championship now. The bar has dropped that low.

The same thing was said elswhere in this thread, I believe.

I think IPO is both, even in it's current form.  Let's face it, anytime we have a standard to train to and money is involved somehow, there will be those that will take advantage of it.  When a "test" is known, it's easy to study for.  I don't care if you're a dog, a person, or a rat in a cage.  Change the test, it won't change the game.

To me, IPO proves you've done the work.  It doesn't mean your dog is breed worthy, but it shows you've taken the steps.  Likewise, if you ARE in fact testing and training your dog and pressuring it and doing the things you need to do to see how it handles pressure and training, then doing an IPO title shouldn't be a big hassle.  you don't have to be pretty to pass and it shows you're actually doing what you claim.  To me, the testing comes in training.  That's when I learn and know my dog.

I've said it before and I'll keep saying it, IPO can be both provided the people doing it are honest.

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