GSDCA Lawsuit - Letter of Clarification from the AKC - Page 13

Blitzen, did you actually want people to see it?

Why would it matter to me if anyone saw it or not? If I cared I'd have copied it. Did you see it?

The way you responded to it after he deleted it sounded like you were disappointed that he did it and more people would not get a chance to see it. Yes, I did see it when I popped in here for a brief second...

Momo,

I was done with this, but, you decided to drag me back in.

My level of education and my level of comprehension I can guarantee you far outweighs anything you could ever dream of.

I will put this in simple terms so that you can simply understand.

The sport of dock diving is a simple one. It requires a dog, a ball or tug, some water, and a few practice sessions.

All you have to do is make your dog jump as far as possible, or in some new versions, as high as possible.

It's a simple sport, it's very easy to understand for anyone competing in it or watching it, in person or on tv.

On tv, which is the crux of its promotion and growth, you can easily show another dog jump every 20 seconds if they choose to do so.

It is very simple to promote and grow because it is so simple.

Schutzhund/IPO is none of the above.

It is very time consuming, and in many ways quite expensive, to compete in.

Biting is offensive to some people and always will be, regardless of how much you educate that person.

(For example, look at how the GSDCA, the parent German Shepherd Dog organization in the United States, has treated bitework and for how long.)

Sch/IPO couldn't be more tv or spectator un-friendly. There are many intricate details that takes time for a viewer to understand.

(I certainly know more than enough people who have trained and competed in the sport for years and they still do not understand some of the finer points to the sport.)

Obedience routines are too long to keep most new viewers attracted as they are flipping through the channels.

The time it takes to show a simple BH routine on tv would turn off most viewers, especially those that do not have a clue of what they are watching.

Tracking might be interesting for a few viewers to watch, but, not for much more than a normal person can watch something like golf.

Let's see what do we have left.....?     ---------->>>> Bitework!

Bitework to the new viewer will be the most interesting thing to watch. It will certainly attract the "bitework is cool" crowd.

It is the only of the three disciplines that will be exciting enough for the new viewer to watch on tv. Just like the others, the bitework phase requires time. In an hour long show with commercials you will probably be able to show about 7 or 8 dogs do their routine. Is this enough to get a network to show it?

I watched French Ring on Animal Planet about ten or twelve years ago. It was an hour long show and so cut up it wouldn't make sense to most people.

See here where dock-diving is much easier to promote?

Simply put, do you see why you aren't comparing apples to apples? You are comparing apples to oranges.

 

One last thing, please do not ever call me a liar. I never lied about anything you said. You just aren't smart enough to comprehend what you are writing.

 

It is the only of the three disciplines that will be exciting enough for the new viewer to watch on tv. Just like the others, the bitework phase requires time. In an hour long show with commercials you will probably be able to show about 7 or 8 dogs do their routine. Is this enough to get a network to show it?

You are, again, leaving out many points that I made.  There is the RH and HGH, plus all the VDH titles, many of which are televisual.  The "sport" you keep speaking of, is FAR more then just IPO.  GET OVER IT ALREADY.

Simply put, you are short sighted.  If Field Dog trials can be televised successfully, certain FCI events can as well.  I won't list them all because there are at least a dozen televised dog trialing events and hosting organizations, NONE of which are "self explanatory" to the average viewer, YET, somehow they are on TV with sponsored teams. 

http://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-23419162

I can continue to give examples to you, all day, if I have to.

Momo,

You can throw in all the crap you want to. We are talking about Sch/IPO.

For some asinine reason you want to equate RH and HGH to IPO. It isn't IPO. They are separate disciplines that the SV, and other clubs if they choose, offer its members.

Is AKC herding the same as AKC obedience?

Why are they not competing in RH, STP, and for the most part, HGH in Germany as Susie has told us?

Why is it not televised?

AKC has had herding for many, many years. Why is it not televised?

Why is AKC obedience rarely, if ever, televised?

There is little to no interest!

Here is another question.

Where are you that RH, STP and HGH is being done so well that you can come on here and criticize others for not doing it well?

How about, Put Up or Shut Up!

 

One other thing. Do you even have a dog? Just curious, what do you do with your dog, if you have one?

It's usually the people who do nothing, or don't even own a dog, that bitch and whine the loudest!

For some asinine reason you want to equate RH and HGH to IPO. It isn't IPO. They are separate disciplines that the SV, and other clubs if they choose, offer its members.

OGBS

The "sport" you keep speaking of, is FAR more than just IPO.  GET OVER IT ALREADY.  If Field Dog trials can be televised successfully, certain FCI events can as well because NONE of these field trial events are "self explanatory" to the average viewer, YET, somehow they are on TV with sponsored teams. 

Simply put, you are short sighted. 

My level of education and my level of comprehension I can guarantee you far outweighs anything you could ever dream of.

OGBS

I'll have to assume this means you have a least a professional graduate degree or are a PhD holding rogue scholar?  Remember you said "education" NOT "life experience".

@OGBS, again having problems understanding the overall concept?  I'm not talking solely about IPO, I'm talking about ALL THE EVENTS that IPO clubs currently ignore to their own detriment.  Besides, you don't seem to know much about the things I'm talking about anyway.  So I can't fathom how "putting up" will change your mind about something you've never seen and appear to have never heard of.

IPO clubs, in the USA, superficially seem to be having trouble attracting younger members.  Under most circumstances, lack of youth participation endangers the future existence of a sport, look at bowling if you have any doubts (yes, I'll admit this is a debatable point, due to lack of published data from USCA)

IPO clubs are authorized to offer FCI events, other than schutzhund, TWO of which qualify for a breed survey and minimize the bitework aspect

IF, the IPO clubs want to survive the "onslaught of anti-bitework" folks and nonexistent youth participation, you are going to HAVE TO start offering OTHER things, which do not focus on bitework, WHETHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT. 

Introducing people to the other aspects of FCI events may open them up to the idea of bite-work training later, once they have learned and begin to better understand the FCI way of showing.  In fact, some of the people whom have the dedication to train and are willing to SPEND money on the sport, may have gotten their first taste of high profile, national competition thought events like Dock-Diving.  So, don't turn your nose up at them because these types could be your only shot at continued participation in the future.

Herding, Rettungshunde, Stöberprüfung and many other FCI events are YOUR SALVATION, with the public at large, and may even open up new revenue streams.

BTW, IPO-R has a world championship, that has 120 entries for the upcomming event in September: http://www.iro-worldchampionship.org/wm-info/?lang=en

In contrast how many entries were there in the last USA Universal Seiger?

In the grand scheme of the overall discussion, its in the best interests of the GSDCA to go the route I have outlined because they need to keep thier AKC base from opposing the WUSV relationship.  The best way to do that is to offer events that educate about FCI showing and that INCLUDES those events that limit or do not have bitework.

Refering to my bowling example, Brunswick has seen such a decline in the business that it is selling all alleys and the products division.  So, if bowling is on the ropes, do you really think your "exclusive" attitude can keep IPO going?  Heck, you're probably 70 years old and won't live long enough to see any of the damage that you are currently inflicting on the community. 

Surely, you do realize, at this point, that you embody the problem and are essentially the poster-child for what is wrong with the overall IPO community.

 Generalities are precisely that--generalities.   My club has increased in numbers every year for the past 4-5.  We  do and have  attracted younger people to the club.  That is one reason why the club has 5 excellent helpers (not counting the TD who trained them all). Three of them have an average age of less than 30.  Clubs attract new members by being open and welcoming to newcomers and visitors, AND by having a good level of camaraderie within the club.  Several of our new members came to the club after visiting other clubs in the area and/or from a negative telephone experience with a club contact.   Telling people that their non-gsd breed is, flatly, not welcome because it is not a gsd is not the way to endear a club to people who may, ultimately, change to gsds once they are in the sport. (It's been known to happen. Ironically, one of the people who apparently consistently blows off  potential members with "alternate breed"  started with...an alternate breed.  (NOT one ever seen doing anything remotely like schutzhund/IPO, seldom even in AKC obedience.)  Having a club in which tensions among members is so strained that newbies can pick up on the negative energy as soon as they open the car door is not the way to encourage participatio in that club.

 

Clubs run as an extension of someone's dog business don't really care about growing club numbers, or encouraging interest in the sport.  They have more incentive for turn-over than bona fide club.  Tthe more people coming, and paying, for classes/lessons/privates until they figure out that they can do better, for less, with a bona fide club and leave, the better.   True clubs are interested not only in attracting new members, but also retaining the veteran members. If the club culture is such that there are few veteran members, it is unlikely that newbies will stay around long.   

 

As OGBS said, this sport requires a LOT of time and dedication.   It also requires a "village" and resources to succeed at even the club level.   While some slick marketing might be nice (and a lot of televised events likely to attract the "wrong people"), clubs need to work on their own culture and projection first in order to "grow" the clubs and thereby the sport.  All the advertising and televising in the world will not result in growth, if people have negative experiences at the club level. 

@Mystere, I agree with everything you wrote in you last post, but keep in mind that OGBS and a few other of similar illk haven't said a SINGLE THING, on this thread, along those lines. 

Don't give credit where it is not due.

Momo,

Your statement:

"IF, the IPO clubs want to survive the "onslaught of anti-bitework" folks and nonexistent youth participation, you are going to HAVE TO start offering OTHER things, which do not focus on bitework, WHETHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT. "

Is not valid. Most if not all IPO clubs offer the RH at trials and help their members train for it. My club is an example, we are having a trail in November and at every training those of us who are going to trial for their RH1 train with the help of our training director. IPO clubs don't offer herding because they are not set up for it nor do they have the resources to do so. IPO and RH can be done in a soccer field. Herding takes a special location with the addition of livestock.

 

Also, I disagree.

"Herding, Rettungshunde, Stöberprüfung and many other FCI events are YOUR SALVATION, with the public at large, and may even open up new revenue streams."

These things take A LOT of time, effort and money to train for and trial competitively in. You can't train these venues by yourself. They all take additional people and resources.

The reason nose work is so popular, is that it (for the most part) can be trained for individually, doesn't take nearly the amount of time or money and can be done in your own back yard or garage.