Dogs that are difficult to manage: what is it like, whats your experience? - Page 1

In the working dog community we keep hearing the cliche " be careful what you wish for ".

I recently had the opportunity to board a 3 year old WL intact male GSD at my home for almost 2 weeks. This was my WORST experience in having to keep/relate to a dog.

A bit on the background of the dog is that he is WGWL and have some very strong dogs in his ped ( Mink, Crock, Drigon, Racker, Eros and Sagus Busecker Schloss ). At 3 years he stands around 26 inches and weighs a very lean 85 lbs. As per his background he ( at 1 year old ) is said to have bitten the wife of his first owner( a retired marine )  in the face for asking him to get off the bed. He was returned to the breeder who then placed him with a Correction Officer. I understand from the correction officer that the dog did a stint as a riot control dog in a prison and then he was washed out of two K9 programs for handler aggression. The correction officer took him back but had him crated for long hrs each day and worked him a bit.

Before I took him home I signed an aggression disclaimer document and I was advised by the correction officer to try and immediately allow the dog to associate me with the source of his food. The strange thing is that when I took the dog he did not even notice that he was being separated from the person who owned him for 2 years. After bringing the dog home I allowed him to stay in my basement. The dog was bouncing off the wall all day and is very driven  and as soon as I approached him he would be literally  all over me  until I gave him chunks of meat. He would down for the next piece but after the feeding was done he would be all over me again. He appeared to have good nerves as no disturbance seem to bother him but he was very head strong and he would just not respond to the pinch even if he was hanging on it. He never lunged at people but if someone got close you could see the devil in that dog's eyes. He already started to become protective of me, but the day I returned him he never looked back for a moment .

My trainer advised me to return this dog ASAP because sooner than later the dog would challenge me. I did as advised and returned the dog to the breeder. Since then the dog has bitten the breeder but they refuse to pts as they think the dog is good .

In my understaning that dog was high drive, no off switch, dominant, hard , and handler aggressive ( even though I did not experience direct aggression from him ).

what have been your experience with a difficult to manage dog?

 

Owner #1 = the breeder...

Owner #2 : "... is said to have bitten the wife of his first owner( a retired marine ) in the face for asking him to get off the bed."

Owner #3 = the breeder: "He was returned to the breeder ..."

Owner #4: = Correction Officer ( What is it ???  ) "...who then placed him with a Correction Officer. I understand from the correction officer ..."

Owner/handler #5 : "...that the dog did a stint as a riot control dog in a prison and ..."

Owner/handler #6: "... then he was washed out of two K9 programs for handler aggression. "

Back to owner #4: The correction officer took him back but had him crated for long hrs each day and worked him a bit."

" The strange thing is that when I took the dog he did not even notice that he was being separated from the person who owned him for 2 years. "

He may have "owned" him, but that´s it...

There are "one person" dogs, not at all that uncommon, I owned 2 of them, very loyal, but not willing to accept anybody besides the original handler they bonded with ( in this case maybe the retired Marine, I don´t know ). It´s difficult to gain the respect of these dogs, and as long as not all ( ! )  members of a family are used to this kind of dogs, they are a liability ...

"As per his background he ( at 1 year old ) is said to have bitten the wife of his first owner( a retired marine )  in the face for asking him to get off the bed."

"Normal" behavior for this kind of dog...

"After bringing the dog home I allowed him to stay in my basement. The dog was bouncing off the wall all day and is very driven  and as soon as I approached him he would be literally  all over me  until I gave him chunks of meat."

It´s a WORKING dog, being locked in a basement MUST drive him crazy...he wants to be with his handler, and he wants to work...( think, move, act ).

What do I want to say?

People don´t need to "like" this kind of dog, but they are out there - they either belong into a "one handler" home, or they belong into a family used to this kind of dog ( seldom/rare - problems foreseeable ).

These dogs do have a hard time when "moved around", they do loose the sin of life - on the other hand they do have problems to accept another handler - and all of a sudden they are called "dangerous"...

They aren´t, they just need their niche, and as soon as the relationship dog/handler fits, you will own one of the best dogs you are even able to think about...

 

Even if they are not what is known as a "one man dog", all that changing of homes and handlers cannot have been good for this boy's mental state. No wonder he doesn't seem to care when his current 'owner' leaves him in someone else's hands, even if only to cover a holiday. He didn't know it was only going to be for a couple of weeks, did he ?

You keep using the phrase "all over me" Mith - twice in your OP here, and you described it that way in a ref. to him on one of the other threds; what exactly does it mean ? 'All over you' how ?
It does not sound as though he was being affectionate ! Was he trying to hump you ? To bite you ? or what ?

My last male, although not 'handler aggressive', had some problems adjusting to life with me;
at 17 months he had been with the breeder, then a house dog with the breeder's daughter, then back in kennels with the breeder again ... and even that much messing around, while still a puppy really, had unsettled him. Your boarder is still a young dog @ 3 years, and as Susie points out, he's already been from pillar to post and back again. It is difficult to draw comparisons with how he behaves
or will behave in the future, compared, for example, to a dog which is raised by his breeder then goes to one solid home as a baby puppy, and stays there.

His genetics and his type lend me to believe he is type dog that most have never experienced, much less owned.
This dog will thrive in very few environments and definitely needs experienced skillful owners/handlers of this type dog. You will not find this type dog in many subsets of the breed.
During Vietnam era, the military would use dogs like this as sentry dogs!

Why should the dog give a flip about anyone, when he's been treated like an inanimate tool that can be passed around?

He probably is a good dog, with the right handler and in the right setting--this isn't the dog I'd want as part of the SAR team sent out to find me if I get lost in the woods, nor is he a good choice for a patrol dog, for the same reasons in each job. As Susie said, with the right handler he would be the dog of a lifetime--but those handlers are the exception rather than the rule, and the appropriate settings for a dog like this are even scarcer yet. There's a DDR-lines dog that was passed around like this, one discussed at length on this site as well as others--Boban vd Grauen Monstaub [won't swear to spelling]. Last I'd heard, the person who had him here in the US claimed he was just fine with her, but that was a while ago & she was using him for breeding, so it wouldn't have been in her best interests to say otherwise, would it? 😉

If you lived in the wild and the chances of encountering other people were nearly zero, then there's a place for a dog like this...but that's becoming impossible in most places in this world, making the world an unforgiving place for these dogs.

Hexe you are on point. They are going to try place him with some hillly billy person who live in the back woods

So in lack of a knowledgeable handler/owner they are trying to find a "hilly billy person" - may be the best for the dog..
I hope he´ll find his forever home, given the opportunity to live a life according to his genetics.

Susie, a Corrections Officer is the police officer that secures the prisoners in a prison or jail.

Hey, Mithuna. Not all people in the back woods are hill billies. (But I will admit to having some relatives some Northerners may call hill billies.)

Thank you, Reliya, never before heard this word ( didn´t seem to be important at school ... )