Civil Aggression - Page 3

@Koach, I have started threads on this forum in archives about decline of discernment in the breed.
@ Shawnicus.....we would have to disagree about capability of civil dog. Civil dogs with good discernment is fine with family if proper boundaries are established.

One other thing, there are many variations of civil dog.....fear biters can be civil, reactive dogs can be civil, prey monsters can be civil, stable defensive dogs can be civil.......some are good family dogs....some better suited for kennel. Some in between....

and there is also training upbringing, like the dog in the video I posted, if I work him next 6 months in prey, or on civil onle, can make him trigger easily or more controlled,

Good post Gustav . As iv said I have to very civil dogs that live with my family very balanced took a long time to totally balance them out . These dog's are super family companions because they have always been respected trained in a confident manner and there power has never been over looked . U also need to raise your family to act correctly around this type of animal . But let me tell u when they switch they are the real thing .

Just reading the comments on this thread. Very interesting topic.
I do agree with Susie's comments and Shawnicus you are so right about finding a "real civil dog", which is reason why
I need to ask.....can you guys direct me to the kennels that still produces these type of dogs. I am located in Germany.
Sorry for going off topic.

You need to hang around the clubs... there are several in your area.

http://www.sv-lg10.de/ortsgruppen

Pfalz
Many "old WGWL " kennels have been known to produce civil dogs ( Korbelbach , Haus Himpel, Maneiche, Furmanshoff, Busecker Schloss, Bungalow ). Also Haus Ming and Tiekerhook in the Nehterlands.DDR dogs going back to Lord , Ingo Rudigen, Ex Reidstern, Golf and Grand Ritterberg. Many Czech lines have some very civil dogs as well, some of the dogs coming through the second and 4th male bloodlines, such as dogs going back to Cordon Ansat through Furos Kamos and sons and grandsons.

I have seen civil dogs that will bite you as soon as you enter their territory ( not just barking to drive awat the threat ). And there are civil dogs that can be off leash in a strangers presence, but they are extremely watchful and will srtike very hard and intensely if need be.

Thank you all for the information.

I hear so many on here, at clubs, etc that want something that isn't easy for the average person/ family to care for. Some people compare a truly civil dog to a loaded gun. I'll take it a step further and say it is like a loaded gun, without a safety, in the hands of a three year old with his finger on the trigger.

Most people can't handle a criminal of a dog. They belong behind bars and many out here think that Spike should lay on the couch and spoon in bed. Having a dog that wants to eat everyone outside of its pack is hard to live with. Doesn't matter if you have a family, or are single.

If you have kids, they have friends. Those friends will visit and not have the same respect or knowledge as your kids. You can't just have Spike running loose at any time. Extended family is no different. When your brother visits, which he never does, you almost want to let Spike eat him, but he has to be locked up.

As a single person, it is just as bad. Unless you lock Spike up often, you are going to be single forever. Are you going to put Spike in a "long down" while you get intimate?

I don't know if we are talking about the same type of dogs. Yeah, you can put obedience on these dogs and get them to comply to an extent, but a truly civil dog is a liability always.

Like Susie said, we're dealing with so many variables, it is insane. What is the dogs total make-up? Most likely it will have some if not most of high prey, dominance, defense, food aggression, etc etc.

Like I said before, I don't think most people really assess their dogs correctly. I don't think most people have seen the dogs I'm talking about. They are rare in most clubs and never at petco. Yeah, everyone thinks their dog eats nails and could leap a three story building to eat your mugger. Just be happy with a dog that will bark and probably bite when push comes to shove. Having a criminal does you no good when he is locked up all the time. What happens when the painter you hired tries to rape your wife while you're at work while Spike is locked up in the kennel? What happens when your kid has a sleepover and a burglar breaks into your house? Is Spike gonna help you from the kennel?

keep in mind if people so much as claim to own a known civil dog and some kid does get bit, then you most likely you will lose your house, and the dog is definitely going to die.