What does a straight back gsd and roach back dog look like - Page 12

Stacking is meant to show off correct conformation.

Many use it to hide flaws too.  I remember that from my show days. 

I meant proper and correct stack.





Which imposes more threat of injury, a slightly arched back (withers still the highest point in the back) or a sagging back?
Which is better for a pregnant female?
Which is better for galloping?
As some notice "roached" backs we do notice also concave/sagging back, why no one ever made a post on this fault?
Arched backs, it all started when breeders wanted to produce GSDs with no sagging/weak backs and did selective breeding to wipe out sagging back which is a very serious life threatining fault to GSD. But as in everything else some crossed the limits.
If I had available only two GSD dogs to choose from, one with a sagging back and one with a slightly arched back I would choose the latter, If I had to choose between severly sagging or severly aroached I would go for another breed.

Ibrahim

In engineering, longer spans hinged at both ends are stronger when arched, and when a span is over loaded it sags till its flexibility point is crossed then it breaks. I'm not very sure that applies to the dog especially when jumping down from say a wall to the ground, but I know it will not be as effective as a straight topline in transferring the momentum from dog's front parts to dog's rear parts or the other way around. 

Linda – My reference to talking about 1 particular dog, was in the context of my ‘anatomy’ comment. Overall we were indeed talking about 2 specific dogs.

I am sorry indeed that there are outlines like these at UK shows no matter how few. One sometimes feels though that it may only be a matter of time. THAT I think is some people’s concern. Kevin’s dog is IMO a beautiful specimen of a SL, with a lovely straight back. Not level - straight. Not overangulated, not roach backed. It came as no surprise to me when he revealed his successes and that he was universal sieger. I think that people have every right to be appalled at both the dogs illustrated earlier, and I for one would like to see more SL acknowledge that this IS a serious problem, and not use terminology which seems to 'allow' for any and all extremes. IMO everyone without exception should appalled at those dogs. I make no apologies for feeling sorry for the dogs either! 

I agree with Sunsilver, a pronounced upward arch in the topline is a roach. A peak or hinge is a broken topline. The SV IMO are doing the breed no favours by rewarding in some cases, very overangulated and roach backed dogs, and in doing so encouraging more of the same to be aspired to, and American judges are doing the same with the excessive rear angulation it seems.

All dogs, including those with a ‘flatter, squarer construction follow a natural S curve of the spine. Other dogs have not been manipulated to have that shape, it mirrors the natural shape of all wild canines, and you will find the shape in many breeds that have not changed in appearance since their origins (elkhounds for example). It is the GSD that has a manipulated shape in terms of (but not only of) the spine, in that the natural upward curve has become more exaggerated today than it was. Read any book on general canine anatomy. The argument has been made for strength for an ‘arch’ which has never been proven, especially when it comes to anatomy. It is a myth.

It is unfortunate that this always degenerates into an argument. I liked Smiley's post, but my one doubt about it was whether indeed everyone does actually have the same destination in mind.

In engineering, longer spans hinged at both ends are stronger when arched, and when a span is over loaded it sags till its flexibility point is crossed then it breaks.

I heard about the above argument being made by roach-back apologists when trying to justify the egregious roach in the GSL GSDs.  Total and mis-guided thinking, is what springs to my mind about that, when that argument is applied to living creatures.   Wonder how a racehorse with such a back is ever able to move around.  You can also notice this kind of backs in wild wolves, who can outdo the best dogs in sheer athleticism and  elegance of movement.

Good points, aaykay! Common sense...At least it should be.

"...the egregious roach in the GSL GSDs."

Does the dog pictured in this thread have a straight back:

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/forum.read?mnr=175641

What affect would higher withers have on the dog's appearance?

Sorry aakaay don't understand the reference to racehorses backs.  What are you trying to
say?