Freaks now in the UK - Page 15

missbeeb "Uber... yes, Uran produced blues... and more! But nobody took their bitch to him with the sole intention of producing blues! Many breeders have had blues and (less frequently) livers over the years, but they don't TRY to produce these colours! I don't know ANYONE who breeds JUST for colour, no, not even rich black & red, it would be hugely detrimental to the breed... that's obvious, isn't it? Responsible breeders consider everything BEFORE they breed."
 
Am I right in thinking then that the problem here is actually unscrupulous breeders who breed without taking all factors into consideration (and therefore risking major health issues) just to have pups and not actually anything to do with what colour they are producing as a result.  I say this as the specific colour doesnt seem to have anything to do with it according to this post. If it were a breeder breeding purely, specifically and solely for black and tan then and not taking health factors into account would there be as much of an uproar?  I personally think there should be.  Surely if the point is that breeders arent caring for the health of our breed and breeding irresponsibly just to get what colour they want then its irrespective of what colour it is they are after?

I have a question though on this first point if you dont mind?  "nobody took their bitch to him (Uran) with the sole intention of producing blues".  Does that mean it was ok for those who took their bitch to him with the sole intention of producing black and tans? 

The point was made no one should breed solely for colour.  Or is the point you are making that no one should breed solely for a colour not classed as acceptable?  Thats not a statement, its a genuine question and I am interested to know.

bazza "You can talk all day about what YOU think of non standard colours, and the breed standard"  You were referring to Pridhams differing point of view there, but actually the purpose of this thread was to do exactly that and to discuss non standard colours.  I think the reason many people got their backs up was because dogs were referred to as freaks, mutants and mongrels. Also because some breeders were referred to by name and inferred they were unscrupulous and had bad practice.  Therefore, YOU can talk all day about what you think about non standard colours but the fact is they exist, they are here, they have a pedigree cert like any other colour and some people will continue to breed them.

My opinion on whether thats right or wrong wont change anything and unfortunately neither will yours.
 

  

No Carole (and Nellie), he wasn't since those are all colours acceptable in the standard already.

Read it again - Malcolm Willis precisely mentioned including blues, livers and whites. It IS a direct quote.

LBW... if one breeds with ONLY one thing in mind, whether it be colour or complete dentition, it's simply irresponsible and quite likely to be detrimental.  One considers the whole dog, it's vitues and shortcomings before selecting a mate. 
 
Black & tan dogs are easily obtained, (world wide) so your comment about using Uran for this sole (?) purpose makes no sense, particularly since he has been "blamed" for colour paling! 
 
I thought my post was pretty clear.  Non standard colours do pop up, most breeders will let them go with endorsed registrations or maybe no papers at all.  Breeding for colour... ONLY for colour is wrong and irresponsible, when you throw non standard colours into the equation, it's doubly so!  I don't know enough about genetics to comment on all the health issues that may accompany some colours, but one should take into account the fact that anyone who shows such scant regard for the Breed Standard, is unlikely to be "hampered" by health checks and limited gene pools!  Just one of the reasons the KC should not have been registering a veritable plethora of colours outwith the Standard.

Thanks Babs for posting the offensive and incorrect garbage from Maggie aka pridlams or whatever she wants to call herself, I would have missed it as I was asleep then spent the day with my dogs not on the computor.
1) I do not consume alcohol, get your facts correct.
2) I do not take or need to take medication for any illness, me thinks you yourself need to see a Psychiatrist they would possibly diagnose PD
3) I am not lonely and will never be as old as you.
4) the breeder in question as had the oppurtunity on 2 other forums to defend her breeding practices but instead chose to leave.
5) maybe you should look up the meaning of 'licentious' and look closer to home!



So you obviously believe it is okay to use dogs that either have not been scored or are extremely high and/or uneven, did you not learn anything by the information I gave you privately about your dog that had HD so severe that it needed hip replacements? obviouly not!

No one breeds for color???

then why don't we see more sables and blk/tans and blacks in the SV ring?  not talking about working lines either, as they generally could care less about color.   Why is it that only a handful of kennels worldwide breeding the SV style dog,  breeds sables for the showring?  majority of the dogs I see in the ring are blk/reds. I've seen some very nice sables around,  but no one uses them because they don't want sable puppies.  and alot of these people will tell you that tehy can't sell sables,  so again its a $$$ thing.  why have sables,  when blk/reds sell soo much better and quicker?

uberland .i think yu should do a more in depth check.sables are on the up here in the uk.there will be an awful lot of sable babies around the ring soon here in the uk.i bred my female 7 and a half year ago,as i wanted a sable bitch to show,unfortunately i only got 1 sable in the whole litter of 6 and she happened to be a long coat so i had to settle for a black and gold bitch.had no trouble selling her in fact.she went for the same price as all the others.I WOULD LOVE A SABLE BITCH TO SHOW.Carole S.

I am not talking about the UK,
how many in germany are being shown? besides the huge group v Arlett shows every year.  How many other breeders use sables?  not that many. 

just look at the VA list
http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/siegershow_winners.html

where's the color variation?  I don't see any type of variation till you get to the early 70's and 60's.  everything else more recent is the same color, same markings ect.  no sables, no blacks, no bi's.  what a pity, since our breed does have such variation in color.