which GSD's are the most titled in history? - Page 12

As I said, workingbreeders want dogs that fit their purpose, hence why performance/workingdogs exist even if there are no regulations like those who breeds mals in holland/belgium. Of course in a perfect world all GSDs breed should be going thru serious health and workingtests so it´s hard to cheat, good luck trying to implement that in germany for all dogs, the german korung is obviously not doing much for save both workingability or a functional body. If a buyer thinks a dog that has gone thru the german korung is any proof of serious workingability it´s easy to just look at those mals or GSDs that haven´t been breed under that systems but still competes at high level in both sport and service and do so better than the majority of the dogs breed in germany. We can´t spoonfeed every buyer and regulate every move a breeder may take, it´s the breeders responsibility to use sound breedinpractice for both health and workingability above the demands that are regulated already. Can´t see how we can avoid that problem unless every genetic defect and lack of workingability are tested, but then I guess many will stop breeding.

Johan, whether it works properly or not was not my issue
in saying the attitude is different.  German GSD owners,
on the whole, expect to work within the SV's rules (whatever
the end product of German IPO trials & Korung).  What is
the proportion of owners & breeders in the USA (or the UK,
for that matter)  who have that expectation and work to fulfil
it with their primarily SLs ?  Ditto how many of the working
folk, really, are bothered about Kor reports rather than trials
scores ?

"Are you saying that the majority of show people care about work??? " You know I don´t ( but I know several, who do ! )
I´m talking about breeders who don´t care about anything, telling me great unproven stories about their dogs.
A trial, a show rating, and a breed survey is not much, but a lot more than nothing.
I´m talking about the minimum, not the maximum.
I really don´t care, if the dog took part in mondio, french ring, police street work, or Schutzhund, but I want to see a dog that proved its working ability AND its conformation is within the standard of its breed.
This should be possible for every breeder of working breeds.

we all should be thankful for the great breed we inherited from the breed fore fathers. von Stephanitz wanted the foundation dogs to all be working sheep herders. He had a problem with ''show dogs'' being the focus. He had clear vision. When Schutzhund [ IPO] was also included into the breed pre requists it opened up opportunity to breeders who could not HGH train their stock. von Stepanitz knew people also, he made rules to follow or ''no papers''were provided  to stop the prolification of non-working GSD. Today's society wants immediate gratification and no work. But with out a clear mandate from breed leaders ''anything goes'' is a mantra [ until the non-training breeder goes to sell a pup and they proudly boast that grandpa was a SCH3] Hey! who has the most titles on a GSD? let's hope part of the alphabet soup says KKL.






 

The 2 I listed were V rated at Sieger shows, KKL1, Sch3 and UD wth agility and other performance titles.

Johan: "...unless every genetic defect and lack of workingability are tested, but then I guess many will stop breeding."
I would appreciate it! Would be more than helpful for the breed!

Susie, but then I see not so much difference between you and me, the only difference  between what you do in germany and here in sweden is that in germany you must enter a show and have an IPO-title for be able to breed, here not all working GSDs are showrated because many don´t see the point unless you want certain titles, this doesn´t meant people are not taking health and workingability in consideration, most dogs breed are working in some form besides the minimum demands but unlike germany this could be all from IPO to policedogs. Breeding on titles would not help so much if a breeder and buyer don´t know what is good or not anyway, so for me titles is not the only things I look for, I must like the dog regardless his titles in both show or work.

I guess it all boil down to how much you should pay atttention to beautydetails, are the dog I posted to uggly to be taken into the genepool, for me they are not, it´s not like I still can see they are GSDs. Even if the GSD is a german breed I suppos this doesn´t mean IPO and german korung is the ultimate way to preserve a workingbreed, I guess also in germany people wouldn´t mind if there were more alternatives to use or even change both IPO and the korung to make it better as a breedingtool. You can also have the best system and trials in the world, but what does that help if there aren´t enough people intressted in participating.

@ Hundmutter...of course I know Susie is in Germany, and we understand each other.
@ Susie....we agree on breeding stock should be worked so that it provides the difference in fantasy and folklore.
I think Susie, Johann, and myself would value the same things in the breed, and breed accordingly even though we are under three different systems and countries. Good dogs come from knowledgable breeders and good stock, regardless of system....IMO.

Johan, as I said earlier, I really don´t care if people train for IPO, Mondio, French Ring, Herding, or Police work - all of this is proof for working ability, every country does have its own "sport" - I´m against breeding WITHOUT PROOF of working abilities and I´m against breeding WITHOUT PROOF of conformation ( health should be obvious ).
To believe that all breeders do care about standard and working abilities without being forced to do the minimum is naive.
A lot of breeders know almost nothing about their breed, they know nothing about temperament and working abilities, nothing about the standard. These "breeders" didn´t even ever raise, train, trial, or show a dog by themselves.
I stick with the German Shepherd my whole life, and I met a lot of people. While listening to them, all of their dogs were the greatest, the best, "worldclass champions", either in working or in conformation. When I saw the dogs I often wondered ...People are blind - either they want to be or they don´t know better.
Breeding rules do help the breed. There are a lot of dogs that are able to do a SchH trial in their own club with their own helper, but later on they fail the breed survey. At least these dogs are out of any breeding program. There are left enough, that shouldn´t been bred, but at least some less...

Gustav: " I think Susie, Johann, and myself would value the same things in the breed, and breed accordingly even though we are under three different systems and countries. Good dogs come from knowledgable breeders and good stock, regardless of system....IMO."

I´m pretty sure our dogs would be similar in character, but my dog would have a different color...