by Kimbertalkls on 08 July 2014 - 17:07
Alot of misinformation here. First, the person selling us Adamo's Simba and Urvik brought three gorgeous males for us to look at. We took all three to our vet on a Saturday and paid for x-rays and tests to be done. Two were purchased by us after our vet, an OFA delegate said the hips were good. Simba is three and Urvik five years old at the time of x-rays and tests.
Second, the owners of Kimbertal are still the Yarnalls. It has never changed hands. The Yarnalls have, for the 23 years that I have worked here, purchased new studs, working titles and champions, to add to the breeding stock. All pups are home raised with local families and have lifetime guarantees. We do not even run ads anymore as vets, repeat customers, word of mouth keeps us going. Only those who do not have the same access to studs seem to bad mouth us. AND Dejan Malbasa has been here to stay at the kennel three times over the years. There is no cruelty here and we try and breed the best dogs we can.
As to the term puppymill, we have already won in court against an individual labeling us with that term. The judge agreed that the term brings to mind a mental image of dirty, inhumane conditions where dogs are bred over and over. Since are females are bred only one litter and then are owned by the family who whelped the litter in their home and since we pass our inspections with flying colors that is not us. Puppymill is a derogatory term that does not fit us. We are open to the public six days a week. I wonder if the naysayers would let all of us tramp through their dog areas six days a week. Also, price increases are due to the rising vet costs(we average about $10,000 a month with the costs of ears and new increases caused by the regulations on the medical field), electric bills soaring due to the kennel regulations on humidity and temps and us having a full time maintenance man to keep up with the constant repairs. Our kennel has a better air conditioner system than the average day care in the state. The inspectors joke with us that PA has the most expensive pups in the country because of all the rules and employees required for the multiple books of paperwork. Stop out anytime during hours to see for yourselves as no appointment is necessary.
by Kimbertalkls on 08 July 2014 - 17:07
Well, in reading over the rest I guess two more points are necessary. One we supply two articles on the ill effects of spaying and castrating. The rottweiler longevity study has released it's findings and also says that most of the older dogs are not neutered. Incontinence, increased joint issues, 50% increase in bone cancer are only the tip of the ice berg. The dog whisper issued his finding on increased aggression on females spayed early but still vets push for it. We can not give a neutered dog to a guard dog service even as they tend to slow down, gain weight and not be of use. And older dogs are not even accepted by rescues because they are hard to find a place for even without aggression issues. Few other breeders are willing to take any older dogs back let alone for reasons like moving or having a baby. We do take them back but we will not lie and say the dog will live here until it is 15 or that it will be one of our studs( every guys fantasy for his dog). We do have some success stories like the ten yearold rott male that was returned peeing blood. I am sure the owner was thinking cancer but it was a bad bladder infection. We found him a home with an older gentleman who Bob supplied with food and medicine to nurse him back to health. That old gentleman cried in the back seat of the car that he had him.
And we give a five generation pedigree on all the pups. The mothers are champion/import sired as wa stheir mother and on back. I can fax a pedigree on any puppy to you and it has the mother's info and on back. We do not show but as stated here anyone who does is awarded a third of their purchase price for a CD, CDX, SchH or championship. We would like to see all of our pups get at least a CD and give that refund.
by Prager on 08 July 2014 - 17:07
Joan no there was no high rate of return by any measure. In 6 mo , there were maybe 2 dogs returned. One was Max Rott. I remember him clearly and I retrained him and he went to the original owner, so it was not really return. The other was some Doberman and he was sold with training next week.No there was no large number of dogs returned.I would venture to say that they do not have any higher rate of returned dogs then you have. :)
by Prager on 08 July 2014 - 18:07
Kimbertalkls I am sorry for missing few points. I am going on what I remember from 30 +/- years ago . I like your post and will attest that it rings true to me. I can attest to it as a person who knew the kennel well first hand. Say Hi to Bob , maybe he still remembers me - the Czech trainer with German Shepherds. I respect Bob tremendously and that is even so we did not part on friendly basis.
by rtdmmcintyre on 08 July 2014 - 18:07
I have always said if you can find a niche you can stay in business. Obviously Kimbertal has a niche or they wouldn't still be in business. They would not be my choice for a Doberman. I am rather particular about the Dobies I buy. Obviously they also take good care of their dogs as well they should its how they make their living. If a carpenter just throws his tools in the back of his truck. That shows he doesn't take pride in his tools and probably doesn't take pride in the product that he produces. I prefer to buy Dobies from people who have the same ideals and goals as I have. They are much more likely to produce what I am looking for especially if that particular litter is also going to produce their next show dog.
by joanro on 08 July 2014 - 18:07
Prager, if they don't have any higher rate of return than I do, then in the six months you were there as head trainer employee, you would not have had any dogs to train. I have had one female who was one year old returned because of divorce, in twelve years. How many returns have you had, Prager? The way you talked,you were training multiple dogs to 're-home. If they only had two dogs to train in six months, seems like employing a full time master trainer was overkill. But maybe room and board was cheap enough pay for training so few dogs.
by rtdmmcintyre on 08 July 2014 - 18:07
Hans enlighten me why you disagreed with that particular post please. What aspect of it do you disagree with? The fact that both parents should be titled? Or the fact that if a person is breeding to any particular standard it makes it easier for a prospective buyer to see if the breeder is producing what they are looking for?
by Prager on 08 July 2014 - 19:07
LOL Jonaro just 2 notes,... who said that i trained there only returned dogs??!! And do you know what "rate" means. Speaking of rate I bet Kimbertal sold at least 2 x more dogs in 6 mo then you sold in 12 years. Thus based on trivial math and even if it would be true that in 12 years you got returned 1 dog, then you got return RATE of dogs higher then they have. And thus you should heed your own advice and I quote" Sounds like (they) you need to have a better method of deciding appropriate owners." I am not going to say that you must be a irresponsible seller selling dogs to people who are going through divorce. That would be as silly as your long distance assumptions and expertise.
For information to others. I trained there dogs which were on rare occasions returned or dogs who matured there ( were not sold as pups) and returned before I got there and dogs of people who brought them there for training. I have seen return only 2 dogs in 6 mo as I said. And one of them went back to the original owner.
Get a life
by Dobermannman on 08 July 2014 - 20:07
by joanro on 08 July 2014 - 20:07
Prager, why don't you answer my question? You/Jinopo must have had more than a couple dogs returned in twelve years.
Yes, I understand " rate".....You still assume Americans are stupid? If Kimbertal sold 200 pups in six months, and IF you are relating the facts accurately, that only two dogs were returned in the six months they employed you, then they had more than twice the return rate that I have had in twelve years. Btw, when the divorcing couple received my puppy, they did not anticipate getting divorced a year later.
For the record, if you are going QUOTE ME, then QUOTE ME ACCURATELY.
One dog in twelve years is still only one dog....but I'm not a mass producer of puppies. The word on buying puppies is, "it's a crap shoot". I have loaded the dice by choosing my dogs, through the years, without compromise.