some thoughts on inherited/genetic character vs. environmental trained - Page 9

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by jettasmom on 23 April 2020 - 23:04

Rik I agree. She will stay with me no matter what. She is the type of dog I’ve never had so who knows, I know she can teach me to be a better handler. She could totally be a diff dog when she is older more mature.
I just want her to live a happy life and that life is with me.

Baerenfangs Erbe

by Baerenfangs Erbe on 04 May 2020 - 15:05

Just thought I'd share my current litter. It's the G litter and they are two days shy of 4 weeks old. Anyhow, today they had their first challenge and I just wanted to see their reaction to it. Would they go over and pick the shortest route, would they get on and then off? Would they go around it and not even try to set a foot on it?

There is always a choice. They have the choice to go over or to go around it but there is always a choice involved. :) this is the video.


bladeedge

by bladeedge on 04 May 2020 - 17:05

Honestly if that was my test. I would definitely do it without the mother in the room. But every one has the own way best of luck with your liter

Baerenfangs Erbe

by Baerenfangs Erbe on 04 May 2020 - 18:05

They are not even 4 weeks old. This is a challenge/exposure but not a test.... 🙄

 


by Nans gsd on 04 May 2020 - 20:05

Just adorable, the all look pretty brave to me. BOL with them.

by ValK on 04 May 2020 - 22:05

every novelty of experience is a test by itself :)
you could continue to record third pup. would be interesting to see what it did, before to decide to join siblings.

by duke1965 on 05 May 2020 - 01:05

nice BE, there is difference between testing and exposing to something, this is good work

there are allways two possabilities to a dog that looks environmentally stable

first, the dog is geneticly environmentally stable, this dog didnot need extremely much work in socializing, and will go anywhere without problem

second, the dog has natural reservations, but is maximum exposed from young age to all kind of environments and undergrounds and rewarded and thereforeshows and feels comfortable on many siuations/locations, but will possibly allways be at risk at some new situation

now this exposing needs to be done with individual pups and without them being triggered into drive, there is a video going round on internet, getting a lot of likes, where they have about 8 malinoispups in a obstaclecours and a woman is clapping and running in front of them, this is not doing much, as they are barking and screaming in a pack running after the lady, barely noticing any object they passed or climbed over, one could wonder of each of theses pups would show when put on a new location alone, without being triggered

transferred to adult dogs, there are many dogs we test that look great triggered into drive by ball or sleeve, but fall apart when triggers are taken away and dog is taken out of comfort zone, lots of offspring and also grandkids of one famous GSD come to mind, many of them, offered to me froze up during this simple test,but totally changed once triggered by ball or sleeve

I have a video of a malinois somewhere that a client bought elsewhere because it was awesome, and he asked me to ship it, once the dog came to my place he asked me to test it, so I did, without triggering it into drive, just calmly walking trough a room with obstacles, dog fell apart, will see if I can dig that one up 


Hundmutter

by Hundmutter on 05 May 2020 - 02:05

BE Nice pups but along with bladeedge I'd like to see them in same scenario but without mum's influence. Also I'd have loved to have seen more on that video of what the other 2 were up to while you were focussed on the one between your feet. May be record similar again in a week or so and show us please ? Loved the insouciance of pup #3 when s/he sat on the crate.

Baerenfangs Erbe

by Baerenfangs Erbe on 05 May 2020 - 06:05

I wont take the mother out of the picture when we are talking about 3 to 4 week old puppies. This is how puppies learn. Through their mother.

All puppies were literally going up and down the gate by themselves just because they could before I grabbed the phone to record it. Red puppy was in the puppy area to pee on the floor and green who left the gate is usually the most bold puppy out of all of them. He got tired and went to sleep.

There is zero reason to take the mother out of the picture. You can still tell the bold and confident from the more hesitent puppy. Especially if you are the one raising the litter. They cant even walk without stumbling all over the place yet and are not even fully eating their puppy food and ya'll would take the mother out? How about learning to actually read puppies and observing them?

Duke: i saw the same contraptions and I dont like them. Not in the way they are being used. Either you have people clapping or food at the end of the chute. So they are always in drive and never really given a choice. A lot of times these contraptions seem to be used in place of natural exposure and learning lessons. I once wanted one of them too but it wont make up for the lessons they can learn out on walks. I have the great advantage to take my pups on post where there are a lot of great training/exposure areas. Its a 30 ton40 minute drive with the pups but well worth it.
Puppies need to explore, digg, sniff and explore some more. Toss in tunnel, something to climb, something unstable or even swinging and just sit back and watch.

There are some barely used great adventure playgrounds on post too.

Btw. at some point I will be no different than the mother. And this is where the skill of reading puppies comes in. Once the mother is out of the picture they will use me (since I am the one feeding and caring for them). That process is already starting.

Hundmutter

by Hundmutter on 06 May 2020 - 02:05

Can't speak for bladeedge, BE, but I did not have it in mind for you to to remove your bitch to an entirely different place for a long period of time ! Just to have Momma crated or held & distracted by someone else, maybe, on the other side of the room for a few minutes. So she wasn't wandering about in the immediate vicinity of your cameraphone, and directly interacting with the pups while you were offering them this experience, is all !

By the time the litter gets to 3 weeks and starts the weaning process, its hardly unusual for a bitch to 'take 5' away from those sharp little claws.





 


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