Question BBS - Page 3

@whiteshepherd: You do not need to tell me that damage has been done & continues to be done to the GSD breed by many involved within it. I give you no argument on that. Rest assured that there are those of us within the GSD ambit who are trying to slow down THOSE sins, also. BUT TWO WRONGS DO NOT MAKE A RIGHT.

Yes, the GSD 'groundwork' had been done; yes, there was already a Standard before most of us alive today were even born. It must surely have been pointed out to you before this, however, that [while you are correct in that there's much hard graft in trying to establish a 'new' Breed and getting it recognised], laying claim to an original development from scratch, putting different breeds together to make a better one, because you can hopefully justify a purpose for yet another breed of dog, would be rather harder work; and a different kettle of fish from taking some existing breed and refining a bit of it, then claiming it as yours, and new.

It is the constant reluctance of BBS/White Shepherd supporters to clarify where 'their' breed started from and their very willingness to allow newbies to believe that all is 'above board' that irritates me into pointing out the facts wherever your 'believers' leave a silence.
Would you be justifying the BBS in the way you just have if I had let Angelena's post stand without saying anything ? On usual form, I think not.

Yes you may all be doing a jolly good job these days (although the BBS breed as a whole seems really rather quiet on some of the diseases and conditions disappointed puppy buyers record, even so - see White Shepherd Forum for examples) and you as a breed really haven't cracked it yet, have you ? Where are all the ELDERLY 'BBS' dogs ? These questions really need to be put, every so often, because they will die out with people of my generation and then no-one will remember.

Would you be justifying the BBS in the way you just have if I had let Angelena's post stand without saying anything ? On usual form, I think not.

I hadn't gotten a chance to click on her link. Busy day.  I don't try to justify the actions of bad or unethical breeders. 

Angelena is doing some marketing for herself or for another breeder. She included her link as if she was sending people to an authority on the BBS....she was sending people to her own website or the website of a friend and trust me, she's no authority on the BBS.

She advertises on the pdb as having RARE long coat BBS. http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/classifieds.viewad?adid=247787

Not sure how someone gets to have the #1 Berger Blanc Suisse in the US (says that on the website..sigh) and be an authority on the breed but not know that the BBS aren't RARE...not even the long coats. The video doesn't explain the difference between a BBS and GSD btw. 

The breeders who own the website she posted; www.bergerblancsuisse.us also breed colored GSD's. www.vomhundhaus.com  Breeders name is Donna Daley I believe. Angelena might just be the name she uses on the database or again, she could be a friend of the breeder.  Wikopedia page was written by this same breeder...probably didn't realize there's another one. 

I don't know what it is you want me to say Hund. I know there are people promoting these dogs who aren't ethical or just uneducated, but that happens in all breeds. This isn't a breeder I would support.

 

laying claim to an original development from scratch, putting different breeds together to make a better one, because you can hopefully justify a purpose for yet another breed of dog, would be rather harder work; and a different kettle of fish from taking some existing breed and refining a bit of it, then claiming it as yours, and new.

If the whites were as defective as people said and say they are/were, it would have taken a LOT of work to get them to where they are today. If they just needed a little "refining", yes it would have been easier but that would mean they weren't all that bad to begin with..it can't be both, which was it?

We claim them as "ours" because the SV first tried to obliterate them and then refused to recognize them as GSD's. The GSDCA (AKC) decided they were so bad they should be disqualified and the CKC in Canada followed suit.  Breeders finding them in colored litters were killing them. The GSD community didn't want them.

They are ours because we are the dog owners, breeders and clubs, past and present, that saw and see merit in these dogs. We kept them alive. We worked to make them healthier. We worked to improve their temperament. We made sure they didn't follow the GSD breed down the road to banana backs, over angulation and other extremes. We worked to give them credibility and improve their genetic worth and we have gotten them recognized as a distinct breed  in the FCI and UKC. 

 ....and NOW people get their feathers in a fluff because the dogs are registered with a different breed name and the WS/BBS breeders and owners have distanced themselves from the GSD breed?  Now after all these years people are upset because we claim them as ours? You bet we do.

I like these dogs, but I am glad they are listed as a different breed in most countries...

Maybe an off topic question, but the American Berger Blanc Suisse breeder does have the FCI logo on the website.
Is it possible for a single person ( breeder ), residing in the USA, to be a member of FCI?
As far as I know only national clubs and IRO are allowed as members,
there is a "cooperation" with KC, CKC, and AKC, but they are no members.

???

You have it right Susie, individuals can't be members of the FCI here in the US. (or anywhere)

Kennel names can be registered with the FCI.
FCI breeding rules permit breeders who live in a country that does not recognise a particular breed to register their puppies in another country that does.
e.g. the UK KC does not recognise the BBS so Ireland can.
I have heard that USA owners of registered BBS can register their offspring in Puerto Rico (FCI)

That´s what I found - never heard about that possibility, wow

http://www.federacioncanofila.org/#!litter-registrations/cr14