A Perfect GSD - Page 2

http://www.adlerstein.com/FreiG.html

I assumed narnia was talking about conformation and look's.

I agree windwalker in that the German Shepherd is so much more than conformation and title's.

VA Frei v d Gugge was a quite example of perfection in a lot of my pedigrees..not show but a medium sized dog of excellent balance and proportions with good front and rear angulation. Nice croup. Wide thigh. Character faultless. Frei was of excellent trainability and character which he transmitted. A line used in the 1970's to aid temperament. Produced one VA progeny and the 1974 Bundessieger Enno vom Antreftel.

Neither.  I wouldn't call either of them "old style" or "closer to original".  Hardly.

"The only Amercan GSD I liked a little better was Dallas and I've seen many of the big winners of the past - great  dogs like Hatter, Gilligan's Island, Mystique."

Did you ever see Benji?  If you're talking modern-era Am lines (granted, like Hatter and Dallas he was all-breed), he was 1 of the best.  And I saw him in person and ended up petting him in person - he was my beloved dog's granddad.

Blitzen,

Timo's sable color comes from his grandmother Ronja who was a dog of "mixed" breeding - showline sire and workingline mother. So, Timo is not 100% showlines, which to me makes him even more intriguing. Here is the pedigree of "Ronja vom Lippischen Norden": www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/13511.html Ronja's breeder Waldemar Schirr was a working judge and a breeder who always had the total GSD in mind. So, he mixed these lines frequently. Timo's sire Wanko vom Lippischen Norden was a 7 week old puppy at his breeder's house when my husband and I first met Waldemar. Unfortunately, Waldemar never got to see Timo's success because he passed away very suddenly. I have kept up, first with Wanko and then with Timo, since they were puppies. It is a crying shame that neither one was used enough by breeders. But that is due to the prejudice against the sable color.  Nowadays, you do not find many breeders who own these sables anymore. And I am happy that we always kept our partnership with Wanko's and Timo's former co-owner  - for 15 years now. As long as we are around, we will always keep sables.

As to the original question: Yes, people say that Zamp Thermodos is one of the most perfected dogs in the world, when it comes to structure. But he himself is not an overachiever on the Schutzhund field, and some of his offspring inherited that trait. I would use him with females who can compensate for that lack of drive. Timo on the other hand does not have that problem. With Timo, you have to be careful about pigmentation (not black markings, but color) and angulations. He works best with Ursus (or Jeck)-blood, perfect example is Orbit vom Huehnegrab. www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/389915.html My Timo-daughter Vila is a great producer and always had something nice in her litters, except for that one time when I bred her to VA-Nando vom Gollerweiher (Enzo - Mark - line). It was one of the worst litters I have ever had, pet quality puppies at best, with a German VA-sire.

Chris

Silbersee:  My mouth and my brain can only think about tomaten right now....lol   hurry home....lol

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/499067.html

Kinda like the Ronja pedigree...here is my bear Jeromes pedigree...

My favorite, though not necessarily the best... from a conformation stand point is Reaction...

He was my last old boy's daddy... Perigrine was less angled in the rear, and broader head...

My other favorite would be Phantom... old lines, lots of German in there...

Both lines were basic stable dogs, with longevity.  Unfortunately both were American Show dogs, and never asked to work in any kind of ring sport... so can't speak to that side of what a shepherd is...  Gimme something 1/2 way between the two and I'll be happy.

 And WHO is this beautiful sable boy...wow beautiful male..I love sable

Julie

Ch Rohan's Reaction... son of Sel Ch. Stutgart's Sundance Kid

www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/508197.html

and he's to blame for my adoration of dark colored sables...  While most of the working European lines seem to be black sable, and Reaction was a Red Sable.  He was a west coast dog, so unfortunately wasn't used much here in the East.

Another nice old Sable... www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/438271.html

Though I adore Reaction, in reality  Kheigh Deigh was a more balanced dog and probably would hold up working better than Reaction...  (btw, they pronounced it Hay Day back when he was showing) Unfortunately the American Ring is Highly prejudiced against sables...  Well, guess that's true in Europe also... but to me there's nothing better than a good one. That's why I flipped over those Stadtfeld dogs that were mentioned last week...

www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/122474.html