** Steep croup/top line from top breeders ** Is this normal? - Page 9

I don't like the GSL example Sunsilver posted.  If that were a photo of my dog, I wouldn't share it. Can't stand the roach in the back during movement.

VKGSD, like it or not, that's what most of them look like! This is not a 'real' dog, just a representative dog, drawn by artist Linda Shaw, who is an extremely knowledgeable GSD person.

http://www.gsscc.ca/the-german-shepherd/articles-by-linda-shaw/conformation-of-the-working-dog.aspx

 

http://www.shawlein.com/

The history of Linda's love affair with the GSD very much follows the breed's history in Canada and the States, and makes very interesting and sobering reading!  http://www.shawlein.com/about/

Above is Viktor (vom Mystical Haus) who is a Czech West German cross.  About 85 pounds.  How is his topline?? A bridge too far??  Viktor was designed for the Zombie Apocalypse .. maybe all of the GSD body shapes are flawed depending on the use and their owners needs.  If you have zombies who need killing Viktor is your boy for that job but as a herding dog he is too large and too muscular to have sufficient stamina for a days work herding woolies.  Viktor is a very large and heavy hammer but if you are driving tacks a tack hammer will do the job faster and better.

 

I know Sunsilver, I just don't like it.  I don't like how the dogs are often handled in the SV ring, pulling so hard.  My dog has been shown 5 times in the SV ring, always received the highest rating available for his age (3x VP, SG, V), but I've never shared any of the movement photos from these shows.  The movement video (and still photos) I use were taken while I was gaiting him next to a bike, completely LOOSE leash, free to move naturally. I also have a few movement photos from UKC shows that I like (where I show him myself, on a loose line).

VKGSDs,  many of the problems have been increased over the years

because people are not totally open about what they have been breeding;

we should not be hiding any dogs 'under the carpet' due to their structure,

(or any other aspect) - in the long-term interest of the GSD breed we ought

to always be open and honest about everything we produce.  Only if we see

everything that can go wrong can we judge it, debate it, & avoid it.

Problem is, some people seem to like and desire to breed the type of structure that others find embarassing. You won't ever find me exhibiting much less breeding dogs like some of the examples in this thread.  No thank you.

in the long-term interest of the GSD breed we ought to always be open and honest about everything we produce.

 

And when points and ribbons become more important than protecting the breed's welfare, and being honest about flaws, that's when things start to go off the tracks. I was shocked by what Linda Shaw said about her American champion:

 

Another successful kennel was literally down the street; Hermsdorf. At the time their young Grand Victor Condor was mopping up at the shows. He was a very good looking dog, and seemed sound enough. I took his half-sister, on a co-ownership, by the famous American stud Cobert’s Sirocco of Windigail ROM. Brynn was a beauty who moved like silk, and she finished her championship with three five point majors, defeating a GV and several Selects. Unfortunately she was both dysplastic and mentally unstable. I finished her CD at the National a couple points short of HIT, and that year she was the recipient of the ‘Champion in Work and Breed’ award from the GSDCC. It was gratifying, but I realized how little that award meant. The day she finished her championship with five points at a large speciality show was something of a letdown. I loved her, but I knew she should never be used for breeding.

I also knew how many of her competitors were no different. Over a period of a decade I watched almost every Grand Victor at the GSDCC National display obvious nervous instability. I lost count of the dogs that crouched, shied, cowered and trembled before judges who apparently didn’t care. The occasional German dog that showed up was so obviously superior in temperament that I couldn’t understand how the judges could ignore it. Apparently side gait was more important. Brynn matured into a truly beautiful female, and with the work I put into her she relaxed and enjoyed showing. There seemed little doubt that she was headed for a Select rating.

About the same time I lost my Max, a feisty old lady of 13, healthy and active but for the tumor in her liver. By now I knew that her bloodlines were extinct and that my old spayed pet had been a far superior representative of the breed than her lovely champion housemate. Her passing left a huge void. A year later, two year old Brynn bounced into the kitchen for her cookie, slumped to the floor and died. Her heart had stopped. Not long after, I discovered that her sire, Sirocco, had sported a heart pacer so he could continue with his breeding career, and had just died prematurely because of it. His owner, Sprock, assured me it wasn’t hereditary. The pathologist rolled his eyes. Whatever faith I had that breeders, judges and breed clubs in North America were committed to breed improvement evaporated right then.

Thank the judges. I've been saying the judges have directed the demise of, no t just the GSD world wide, but likely every breed being "judged" by show ring folks.

Read Linda's site, Joan. She would completely agree with you!  But it's not just the judges, it's the whole setup  typical of most kennel clubs. The selection is made on looks, encourages the development of extremes in gait and structure, and the development of genetic bottlenecks, due to everyone breeding to the popular sires of the day!

 

For years after I got into the breed, I would hear that the purpose of showing and breeding was to improve the breed. Forty years later I can think of no breed that has been improved by the show ring. You would think that after forty years and no progress, breed clubs would figure out that the system isn’t working very well, and find a better way to screen breeding animals. But people love theatre, and the show ring isn’t going anywhere anytime soon.