How do you teach the dumbell? - Page 9

Oh darn it all, there it is, my secrets out, I'm secretly in love with the big guy, all women are, just ask him.  Funny stuff, Stephanie!!   By the way, if he also told you that in addition to throwing my panties at him in PMs all I've done with dogs is put a BH on a dog in 10 years, and I'm not really sure what the "10 year" figure has to do with anything at all, but no matter he was wrong about that too,  lol, lol. 

Actually I do like a lot of what Jeff has to say about training and breeding, though obviously we disagree on a number of things as well, and I do think he can be very funny, even almost charming, but believe me Stephanie, I'm an old woman, it's been more than 20 years since I have even thought about wanting  to throw my panties at anyone.   Unfortunately those days are long gone, nothing but a distant memory to me...... prolly why I spend an inordinate amount of time training dogs now!!!

Sue doesn't wear them!

looking at the obedience routine in general, I wondered what
the founding fathers had in mind. The suitability for breeding
would in theory say the dog should have the traits to complete
these task without alot of tricks. But I have seen things that
people have invented over the years that defy the imagination.

If you are using SchH for dog selection as it was created,..
there should be accepted practice...That if Don was teaching the
the dumbbell routine he had solid information. But I would say
in every aspect,.. all 3 phases there are tricks and that is because
there are many personalities in the GSD and handlers here in the
USA.

 @Sue-I will venture to say that the fact you haven't had the desire to throw your panties at anyone in 20 years may have something to do with your controlling buttinski tendencies. Jeff has not told me anything about you-you are projecting again. Here's hoping that the inordinate amount of time you spend training is better spent than the inordinate amount of time you spend on this board trying to control the flow of conversation.

Back OT-here's some video of someone who is a great teacher, gets paid and yet does not feel the need to talk down to the masses and withhold information.

Same concept, different juice AND some guidance as to reading and timing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPRvrBAbqWk

uh Steff, YOU  are the one who butted into the topic, I was already here.  You just don't like my answer, which is pretty much the same as everyone elses response to you,  and as usual you are  a rude asshole about it, but hey, that's your problem, right?

You want to have a private conversation with someone, here's a clue, take it to PMs  this is a public messageboard.   

Once more for you Steph,  no one is withholding info in the hopes of making money and no one is talking down to anyone.  The FR needs to be taught in person because this is something you need to develope a feel for, and something that's really easy to screw up, with the result being  a dog permanently messed up,  that's all, no conspiracy, no hidden agenda.  

By the way, I don't think you're a meanie, I do think you have some anger issues and you take your self far more seriously than you really should, which makes you laughably entertaining,  I guess you're just  a wanna be.....something.

VKGSDs you said:

The same can be said for a completely backchained, freeshaped retrieve though, it is extremely complicated. People often rush or throw in other bits and pieces (like backtying the dog and waving a dumbbell around, trying to make the dog interested in the dumbbell itself) that create more conflict and problems where there doesn't need to be. Many people have poor timing when it comes to mark/reward training, or they do not break down the behaviors into small enough steps. Dogs get frustrated and show avoidance, people start blaming their dog or the method. Likewise it is not a process that can really be trained and understood "over the Internet".
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I agree, very good points.   Regardless of what method is used,  seeing is one thing, doing is a whole different animal.   Video is a great tool, but it's no substitution for a great coach/trainer,  someone experienced who can guide a person.

Steph, so far many of you comparisons really don't apply to the topic of discussion.  The video of Bart demonstrating LIVE to a group of people how he does a retrieve is not the same as someone putting together text to post here.  Physical demonstration while monitoring it's application is far better than putting words on paper and expecting someone to grasp technique.

 Sue. I am not Stephanie. I use the same computer, but she has her own thing and I have mine. 

I also could give a **** about seeing the  forced retrieve in written form, if using positive will fail bla bla bla. 

This is her thing..