** Steep croup/top line from top breeders ** Is this normal? - Page 7

Good for Rudiger Mai to speak up against that ridiculous structure. I knew I liked him......oh yeah, he's the one who gave Capri her V against all the black and reds...  Nice to hear of a judge who is not only fair, but acknowledges the faults being perpetuated.

While the German GSD may have a bear head the ASL tends to have a "collie head" and a shorter neck so that may account for part of the apparent difference.  Some of the Dutch dogs look as if they will walk only on their front legs with a very long and extended neck with a lot more weight forward.  Coat length for ASL I think tends to be shorter and thicker perhaps ?? different at least than the longer coated German dogs many refer to as show line.  I have a Czech male who apparently has no neck .. just a big block head attached to a huge chest with a long and thick coat it is hard to tell where the head ends and the neck begins except for some little short bear ears.  I took some 3 month old Czech pups to the vet once and he said if he didn't know ( I told him ) he would think they were black bear cubs.  They grew up to be typical Czech looking GSD.

I'm with you VKGSD. I continue to be appalled at the photos I see advertising one's dog or litters. The movement photos are especially "interesting" to me.

Bubba, I used to work with a woman named Nancy Roach.

I think ASL's generally have longer necks than GSL's. Coat length is about the same, but ASL's are groomed more using cattle dryers. So their coats look more, well.....groomed. I've never seen a grooming table at an SV show, everyone uses them at AKC shows. IMO ASL's are better groomed and handled than most GSL's. No dog trailers at AKC shows. Vans or RV's mostly. Double handling is not nearly as out in the open at AKC shows, actually it's illegal, but most judges let it happen.

ASL's definitely tend towards larger necks.  Coat length is also quite variable and varies region to region and is heavily based in lines.  You see dry coated dogs coming from specific lines just as you see well coated animals.

 Blitzen .. Bubba, I used to work with a woman named Nancy Roach.

Roach back is not going to go over well with her then .. I lived in Greenville, MS and we had Roach Street

 

Is it called a Carp Back when the curve is on the withers and a roach when on the loin? A curve or "Peak" on the midsection has another name as well if I remember. (Did the Dog Steps book cover this?)

(Nice Visual from Sitasmom)

This is a roach back.........see yellow line

I think dog steps or some book called the above a "Wheel Back".

Yeah, Lineage, I find the terminology gets interchanged

all the time.  A true 'roach' is a too high rise over the loin -

so it isn't technically the dog's "back" at all.   Most of the

sighthounds and other breeds where the roach is expected

or required also use the term "wheel", particularly in older

documentation.

We don't see "carp" too much over here in the UK, def. an

'Americanism'.  LOL  Would seem to describe the high, curved

wither fairly aptly though. 

USA doesn't seem to refer to the "hinge" as much as we do,

preferring "broken"...

 

But which of these faulty toplines are any worse than another ?

 

All good books on GSD have a diagram based on the original Standard

showing the smooth unbroken, very slightly upward curved line that is the

ideal  [ unless of course you are a fan of weak dippy backs, and 'ski slopes',

often referred to as straight or level or flat when they are no such thing !]  and surely

that is what we should all be aiming for - not extra long necks, 'rounded' withers,

dips behind withers, too short (actual) backs with too long croups and the

broken / hinged effect, nor steep or short croups, or raised loin areas.

 

:) 

Found this on Pedigree database recently.
an Un-Steep Croup and Extreme Sway back.
Gucci von den Lausbuben