FCI standard vs the AKC standard - Page 11

Easy,

It's an accident if you can't duplicate it.  Is the whole litter excellent?  Is there a pup in the next litter that is excellent as well?  If not, then it's an accident.

If I get detailed with statistics about  5 generations after my first Sch3, UD import, will you accuse me of bragging? I didn't breed any of them, I'm not a breeder, I owned a few, trained to a few titles, and knew most of them. Right now the 5th generation is kicking butt in the OB ring, has not yet been protection tested and may never be. His owner doesn't seem to be interested. Would he count? They are not accidents.

Protection is part of the breed test.  If you don't know that part then he can't be great.  He's not even breed worthy at this point.  That is what following the standard means. 

Its sometimes rough, but you have to adhere to it.  I've had great ob dogs who couldn't grip.  I've had an awesome tracking dog who'd rip your arm off on a long bite.  Bark and hold?  Boring..... He'd walk away from the helper.  Not nervous, bored.  His Obedience was ok for 3 minutes and then bored again.  Not a breedworthy dog. And he was out of a WUSV Competitor, His uncle (Father's litter mate brother) won the WUSV and his mother was a LGA competitor in Germany and her Brother competed in the BSP.  We used him as a helper tryout dog.  He loved to do that. 

You can't judge on one little piece of the picture.  Its a composite of everything. 

Maybe GSD's should be required to do both? Couldn't that get interesting?

Seriously, how many who breed to the SV rules get entire litters of excellent dogs? If they can't then any good ones they produce are accidents?

Don't you think a breeder who can consistently produce IPO AND advanced OB dogs -same dogs - is doing better than a breeder who only produces IPO titled dogs?

Blitzen, IPO does involve advance obedience in it already.

HD, as I recall, IPO  OB is not as involved as a UD and for an IPO pass the dog only has to qualify one time if he passes the tracking and protection on the same day. Takes 3 legs for a UD,  3 different judges, 3 differnt trials. 10 legs qualifying in open B and UD both on the same day to get a UDX.  I think a good  UDT dog could easily pass all the OB and tracking phases of IPO, the protection would be the challenge.The dog we are showing right now with the UDX, TD could probably pass the OB and tracking phases of all IPO degrees, but he's not breed worthy because he hasn't been tested in bite work. How many IPO3 dogs could earn a UDX?  We will never know.

Can you refer me to a link that describes the OB exercises for all the IPO phases. I don't recall them as being particulary challenging for the average obedient GSD, but it's been a while since I was at a trial. Thanks.

could probably, i don't recall, could easily.  Ok, DO IT!

Blitzen, the other person, bzcz is more qualified to give you a link to IPO exercises in obedience, however, I will tell you that they much more exacting then the obedience phases of other sports. Even though IPO is not something for me, I will admit that it does take a lot of work to get a dog to perform at that level of precision, but, that is more of a handler time and effort and showcases the trainer's skills more then the dog's.

Since I have never done any AKC work, I have no idea what is needed for a title with that organization, but, I do agree that since a GSD was created as a working animal, its ability and desire to bite should be demonstrated besides the obedience and tracking parts. When you have a moment, google FMBB and look at the IPO obedience routine of Mia Skogster, she is amazing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qv3qmMU3jOc - ZVV Obedience
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQplwJeMvt4 - ZVV Obedience
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewhz8e6ThKc - IPO Obedience
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hzs2Ebf-W4 - AKC style Obedience