NASS Results??? - Page 10

I think the most important question that arises vis a vis the results was tangentally raised by Mr. Medlen. A few years back every major breeder in the US and masses of small guys entered NASS. There were close to 500 dogs. With the exception of John Henkel, why did none of these other breeders show at the NASS?

Where was Haus Juris, where was Mittelwest, where was Drachenberg, where was Alta Tollhaus, where was Wustenberger Land, where was Kirchenwald to name a few? And why weren't they there.  Because in every instance the executive board of the WDA took punitive actions agains and  or discrimated against these breeders, (at whose behest I wonder). Actions which ranged from suddenly changing the rules as to which dogs were the highest American bred dogs to preventing kennel groups from being shown, from election shenanigans, to trumped up charges.

So is it any wonder they stayed away? In days gone by, everyone had a fair chance. Now, its no longer a level playing field. Sadly, this is not about the dogs, its about the people.

Dog1

Quit spinning in the wind and making my points for me would ya!  You make this way too easy.

First off you somehow twist nephew into sibling?  Wherever you are at, over here those are different.  Rory is Johns' nephew last I knew.

Secondly, Steve had to quit training those dogs.  That's in the WDA rules.  Once your selected as a helper you HAVE to not work any entered dogs or they will remove you as helper.  Glad to know that you agree with the WDA ethics.

Regardless, those dogs Steve was working didn't have an advantage anyway since they had worked with him extensively before hand?

I agree with you Gertrude.  Everyone should figure out why all the shows are dropping in numbers.  Alot of kennels gone period and others I don't know.

There is an obvious perception problem in the WDA when half of them left to join up with the GSDCA movement.  I don't know what happened and I don't pretend to.  Regardless WDA alienated alot of people and they need to look in the mirror and figure it out if they are going to survive.

I jumped in this thread because I got sick of reading about crooked judges and the fix is in and all the conspiracy nonsense.  There's crap that goes around in all orgs.  I was a delegate at the USCA GBM where they took Henkel to task and pretty much alienated him.  Mittlewest was alienated from WDA over the whole tail deal.  The rest I have no clue.

The infighting between the orgs has been going on for decades and I don't see it stopping anytime soon.  I sure wish it would.  You have a problem with the orgs, have at it, I don't care.

But don't start calling the judges and helpers crooked.  I know a lot of the helpers out there and that assertion is pure BS. 

Looking at these "events" from far away, I think your "community" is small, any helper might be someone´s nephew...
It´s allowed internationally, as long as handler/helper are not part of the same household.

Besides that, I´d be careful about blaming a good helper on any open forum - these guys are on the field for you during the whole year, in winter and in summer, and I never met a helper who initially worked against a dog. most of these guys have better ethics than a lot of handlers ( at least over here ).

Why don´t you establish one Siegershow for " the best of the best ", GSDCA, WDA, USCA, too many VA ratings in your country ( VA = V rating ??? )

Susie,  Thank you for the voice of sanity!

You never answered the question.  What about the helper and the dogs he's worked when the helper gets selected?  All the dogs he's trained should be barred from entering becuase it would be an impropriety? What about a competitors dogs who works on that helper? Is it assumed that the helper will be hostile to a competitors dogs?  How far down the mousehole would you like to take this ridiculousness?

If you are talking to me, no it wouldn't be a problem for me, but I can see that some  might go down your proverbial mousehole in reponse. I don't show at SV shows and don't plan to stay involved with this breed for much longer other than at a local level, so helper selection at a Sieger show is immaterial to me. I don't think I've ever even commented on that here or anywhere else.

Susie, it's hard to argue against the benefits of one annual sieger show in the US. Each AKC Breed club holds only one National event annually so there can be only one BOB and one BOS national winner annually. In this country, I think there are too many different SV organizations involved to ever make that happened. If there were only one as in Germany, it would be very possible. With 3 and all the baggage each would bring to the table, it's probably never going to happen. Trying to be the voice of reason would be bringing a knife to a gun fight.

"Why don´t you establish one Siegershow for " the best of the best ", GSDCA, WDA, USCA, too many VA ratings in your country ( VA = V rating ??? )"

susie, you silly woman, because this is AMERICA, and that means everyone gets to start their own organization if they don't believe they are getting their fair share of power and influence [which naturally translates to their fair share of financial gain].  As 'Americans', we are far too independant as to do something so out of character as to cooperate with one another! [I swear, if someone doesn't create one soon, I'm going to have to make a concerted effort to come up with a 'Sarcasm' font or symbol...the world sooo needs one of those!]

Seriously, though, at the rate we're going, eventually everyone will be able to have their own National championship event , and we can all award our dogs VA placements and brag about how we each have the very bestest dog in the US of A!

In my opinion, it is really simple.  The WDA Sieger Show was a disastrous flop not because the members quit supporting the WDA  and its events. The flop was the result of leadership running the members off.  As I see it, the club as it exists now is a perfect example of far too much power in too few hands.  An old adage is: "Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely".  You can't have a successful club run by and for the elitist especially when those elitists appoint themselves as the elitists. Beware of kings and king makers for they will operate in concert to isolate themselves and become invincible at the top of the pyramid with a castle wall protecting them from their little people. I would never want to be a part of an organization of equals run by a handful of those who appointed themselves to be  MORE EQUAL.

Blitzen:  Actually, I believe there are now two GSD Clubs in Germany. Several years back, long time rebel in the SV, Helmut Raiser(sp?), formed his own club, known as RSV2000, and I have been told that the FCI recognizes their registry. Not many years ago there was yet another in Germany, the Long Coated German Shepherd Dog Club, and they actually issued papers also although I was told their papers were of essentially no value except to their own group.  I don't know if Raiser or the Long Coated Club (if it still exists) ever got around to holding a Sieger Show though. One or both probably will as soon as they see how much money such and event could make them.  

I wouldn't hold my breath on Raiser holding a Sieger Show