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by Jantie on 13 November 2010 - 07:11
I hope Koach will forgive me, for sharing the knowledge of his friends on this thread as well!
(A heartfelt apology Koach!!)
Koach writes this:
"I just had an email from some friends of mine from Australia who are trialing their Malis in Germany (Jens and Alison Kollenburg). They gave this report about a TV program in Germany which has exposed the SV for what it is. Very interesting. Read below."
"Hi Guys
They just had an incredible program on the BR Alpha channel here (in Germany) last night, about the GSD breed and SV.
The program itself was one hour, and is a similar program to Panorama (investigative journalism) that they have in the UK. And man, they did a real thorough job on the background research - started with some backgrounding on the breed, then explained the SV Siegerschau and the set up of the selecting the winners, the testing etc, the hierarchy of powers-that-be and their power monopolies. They did interviews with the top guns in SV and then interviews (some with shadows and disguished voices) of SV members and former (resigned) SV judges amongst other complainers from the inner and outer circles, all explaining about the "known" corruption in delegting the big titles and more or less, how it's all about money. They compared the monoply of power and the culture of money for "favours" (wins) as that of a Mafia, which it is, of course.
Then they had interviews with "dissidents" who have broken away from the system because of the problems it is causing the breed. Enter a short sequence on RSV2000 and interviews with Helmut and Eugen E. etc., and then some footage of Helmut working a GSD while explaining the funationality of what the work was about. They had interviews with overseas fanciers from all the rich wog countries who pay the real big bucks for "German" dogs - only German dogs! are good enough..."it is the Motherland of the breed"..and because to win under prestigious German judges one needs to buy the dogs from the "approved" bloodlines! (Yeah, that is a breeding plan, alright.) "Approved" being stamped on those dogs where the most money has been paid to the most important people.
Plus interveiws with vets and similar canine (geneticists etc) specialists about how the breeding the GSD has resulted in a serious degeneration of the breed's health and functionality. They went through a few of the problems seen at the clinics. Too many GSDs are "finished" by seven years due to a range of genetic health problems plaguing the breed ...which I noted, was also why many GSD people here said they moved to Malinois..that they had bought two or even three GSDs that then either up and died or were incapacitated due to a genetic problem. As well as interviews with vets, there was interviews with the hierarchy in the service dog groups, discussing the falling popularity of the breed and why. The police dog squads showed their dogs on the job while explaining what they wanted - one scene in a crowd riot zoomed in to show a GSD hiding behind the handler (the speaker noting how the GSD wanted to hide while the Belgian Shepherd standing next to it was leaning forward and ready for the action). A not very flattering comparison to have on national program. The police officers interviewed explained the working character of the dogs they used and they gave the thumbs up for the Belgian Shepherds, which the police explained they were replacing their German Shepherds with because of the BS's higher aptitude, breeding for functionality, and their consistently outclassing the GSDs in the work place environment.
It was a really impressive program. Very controversial as they pulled no punches and exposed what "everyone" has known for decades - that SV is a Mafia with an international reach. The program was one hou
(A heartfelt apology Koach!!)
Koach writes this:
"I just had an email from some friends of mine from Australia who are trialing their Malis in Germany (Jens and Alison Kollenburg). They gave this report about a TV program in Germany which has exposed the SV for what it is. Very interesting. Read below."
"Hi Guys
They just had an incredible program on the BR Alpha channel here (in Germany) last night, about the GSD breed and SV.
The program itself was one hour, and is a similar program to Panorama (investigative journalism) that they have in the UK. And man, they did a real thorough job on the background research - started with some backgrounding on the breed, then explained the SV Siegerschau and the set up of the selecting the winners, the testing etc, the hierarchy of powers-that-be and their power monopolies. They did interviews with the top guns in SV and then interviews (some with shadows and disguished voices) of SV members and former (resigned) SV judges amongst other complainers from the inner and outer circles, all explaining about the "known" corruption in delegting the big titles and more or less, how it's all about money. They compared the monoply of power and the culture of money for "favours" (wins) as that of a Mafia, which it is, of course.
Then they had interviews with "dissidents" who have broken away from the system because of the problems it is causing the breed. Enter a short sequence on RSV2000 and interviews with Helmut and Eugen E. etc., and then some footage of Helmut working a GSD while explaining the funationality of what the work was about. They had interviews with overseas fanciers from all the rich wog countries who pay the real big bucks for "German" dogs - only German dogs! are good enough..."it is the Motherland of the breed"..and because to win under prestigious German judges one needs to buy the dogs from the "approved" bloodlines! (Yeah, that is a breeding plan, alright.) "Approved" being stamped on those dogs where the most money has been paid to the most important people.
Plus interveiws with vets and similar canine (geneticists etc) specialists about how the breeding the GSD has resulted in a serious degeneration of the breed's health and functionality. They went through a few of the problems seen at the clinics. Too many GSDs are "finished" by seven years due to a range of genetic health problems plaguing the breed ...which I noted, was also why many GSD people here said they moved to Malinois..that they had bought two or even three GSDs that then either up and died or were incapacitated due to a genetic problem. As well as interviews with vets, there was interviews with the hierarchy in the service dog groups, discussing the falling popularity of the breed and why. The police dog squads showed their dogs on the job while explaining what they wanted - one scene in a crowd riot zoomed in to show a GSD hiding behind the handler (the speaker noting how the GSD wanted to hide while the Belgian Shepherd standing next to it was leaning forward and ready for the action). A not very flattering comparison to have on national program. The police officers interviewed explained the working character of the dogs they used and they gave the thumbs up for the Belgian Shepherds, which the police explained they were replacing their German Shepherds with because of the BS's higher aptitude, breeding for functionality, and their consistently outclassing the GSDs in the work place environment.
It was a really impressive program. Very controversial as they pulled no punches and exposed what "everyone" has known for decades - that SV is a Mafia with an international reach. The program was one hou
by singer on 14 November 2010 - 07:11
That program is years old it's been on German TV before
What's new?
What's new?
by peterlee on 14 November 2010 - 10:11
More distractions from Jantie.
Stick to the facts, Jantie. Where is your EVIDENCE for the so called 'ruined hips' of Zara von der Zenteiche??? You have produced none. That is the reality behind this thread.
A second hand account of a TV program by some dimwit who uses words like 'wogs'. Wow. Great evidence of Zara's 'ruined hips', Jantie.
Stick to the facts, Jantie. Where is your EVIDENCE for the so called 'ruined hips' of Zara von der Zenteiche??? You have produced none. That is the reality behind this thread.
A second hand account of a TV program by some dimwit who uses words like 'wogs'. Wow. Great evidence of Zara's 'ruined hips', Jantie.
by peterlee on 14 November 2010 - 10:11
Oh, and by the way, the makers of TV programs know they don't get viewers with good news stories. Which of these two events do you think gets reported?
(1) 100,000 flights took off and landed today without incident or
(2) Light aircraft crashes. Four killed.
And which tells you more about the safety of air transport?
It is much the same with TV reporting of dogs or the SV or anything else. 'Ruined hips' Jantie will always belong in the 'four people killed' category. People who really want to improve anything focus on the positive rather than the negative.
(1) 100,000 flights took off and landed today without incident or
(2) Light aircraft crashes. Four killed.
And which tells you more about the safety of air transport?
It is much the same with TV reporting of dogs or the SV or anything else. 'Ruined hips' Jantie will always belong in the 'four people killed' category. People who really want to improve anything focus on the positive rather than the negative.
by Jantie on 14 November 2010 - 14:11
You have absolutely no idea what's cooking in the kitchen Peterlee!
And if you don't want to look like a moron afterwards, you'd better hold your horses.
Remember: "Man begegnet sich immer zweimal im Leben!"
("You always meet twice!" - Guess you don't speak German too well, so I will even offer you the translation.)
Think about that when we meet again! Shortly!
And if you don't want to look like a moron afterwards, you'd better hold your horses.
Remember: "Man begegnet sich immer zweimal im Leben!"
("You always meet twice!" - Guess you don't speak German too well, so I will even offer you the translation.)
Think about that when we meet again! Shortly!
by peterlee on 14 November 2010 - 14:11
Same old, same old. The whole story soon!! etc etc
David Payne has given the only credible explanation of what happened. You have failed to produce any evidence nor have you been able to contradict his account. Nothing changes.
I suppose we may expect more fantasy and more distortions of the truth. I shall look forward with interest to your latest 'revelations'. My guess would be that they have nothing to do with the allegations you have made about Zara but that they will be some new nonsense to distract attention from the fact that you have not provided any evidence to justify the allegations you made in this thread about a particular dog and about the owner of that dog.
David Payne has given the only credible explanation of what happened. You have failed to produce any evidence nor have you been able to contradict his account. Nothing changes.
I suppose we may expect more fantasy and more distortions of the truth. I shall look forward with interest to your latest 'revelations'. My guess would be that they have nothing to do with the allegations you have made about Zara but that they will be some new nonsense to distract attention from the fact that you have not provided any evidence to justify the allegations you made in this thread about a particular dog and about the owner of that dog.
by Videx on 14 November 2010 - 16:11
Regurgitation is a habit of the bovine species, a habit Jantie has acquired, regurgitation finally results in bullshit.
by Jantie on 14 November 2010 - 18:11
You don't seem to be so well-informed anymore David!
YOU of all people should have some idea of what's cooking in Germany! (Evil grin!)
Call some of your "friends"!
YOU of all people should have some idea of what's cooking in Germany! (Evil grin!)
Call some of your "friends"!
by Videx on 14 November 2010 - 21:11
Jantie: Clearly you form your very biased opinions on very limited information. That explains a great deal about what you write..
by eve127 on 15 November 2010 - 07:11
quote: Does it help when someone says, 'We know what's going on in Germany, don't we?' You are, I hope, honest enough to know the answer to that. Whenever someone or some organisation is accused of cheating or dishonesty - especially in a public forum like this - then I think all fair minded people want to see proper evidence for the accusations.
@peterlee: yes, you are right. I have to admit that accusations without proper evidence are nonsense.
However, I know the story Jantie is talking about quite well. To me he is not a liar.
Everyone has to decide for himself/herself.
There are too many things in Germany people know but do not talk about because they are simply
frightened. Frightened to lose their reputation, frightened of whatever. The German Show Dog
business has become way too corrupt over the last few years. We all can see that.
You can go and see the evidence. It is obvious. I've been to far too many shows and seen the
better dogs being put behind those who have the reputation. Put behind those who are judge's dogs.
I've seen crippels on top.
What I call "crippels" are dogs who are so over-angulated that they can't even walk properly.
But they look good on photos. Oh yes, they do. The side line is georgious. Yes it is, but how come the dog cannot even stand properly???
I've seen dogs with obvious allergic reactions on top. Would you use them as a stud dog??And no one dares to say a word.
But what would this help anyway??? Judges judging their own dogs, dogs not beeing excluded from the show although they show fear and can hardly be measured, dogs having a rather light color one day but beeing red-brown on the other etc, etc, etc. I could continue this list for 3000 more words. And I've seen it myself. So to me: IT IS PROVEN. Proven to me are things I've seen with my own eyes. Proven to me are words that come from people I trust.
And I assume peterlee, you have at least seen some evidence yourself.
There is one German judge that comes to my mind (his homepage :
http://www.schloss-veitenstein.de/frame.htm ) who seems to be different from the others.
I write "seems" because I don't know him personally. But on his homepage (I'm sorry but I think
there's no English version available) he provides some open comments on the scene.
BUT and now there comes the big BUT: A "rebel" like him would never become a Siegerschau
judge.
Have a nice day! (I've already written more than I ever wanted :-)
@peterlee: yes, you are right. I have to admit that accusations without proper evidence are nonsense.
However, I know the story Jantie is talking about quite well. To me he is not a liar.
Everyone has to decide for himself/herself.
There are too many things in Germany people know but do not talk about because they are simply
frightened. Frightened to lose their reputation, frightened of whatever. The German Show Dog
business has become way too corrupt over the last few years. We all can see that.
You can go and see the evidence. It is obvious. I've been to far too many shows and seen the
better dogs being put behind those who have the reputation. Put behind those who are judge's dogs.
I've seen crippels on top.
What I call "crippels" are dogs who are so over-angulated that they can't even walk properly.
But they look good on photos. Oh yes, they do. The side line is georgious. Yes it is, but how come the dog cannot even stand properly???
I've seen dogs with obvious allergic reactions on top. Would you use them as a stud dog??And no one dares to say a word.
But what would this help anyway??? Judges judging their own dogs, dogs not beeing excluded from the show although they show fear and can hardly be measured, dogs having a rather light color one day but beeing red-brown on the other etc, etc, etc. I could continue this list for 3000 more words. And I've seen it myself. So to me: IT IS PROVEN. Proven to me are things I've seen with my own eyes. Proven to me are words that come from people I trust.
And I assume peterlee, you have at least seen some evidence yourself.
There is one German judge that comes to my mind (his homepage :
http://www.schloss-veitenstein.de/frame.htm ) who seems to be different from the others.
I write "seems" because I don't know him personally. But on his homepage (I'm sorry but I think
there's no English version available) he provides some open comments on the scene.
BUT and now there comes the big BUT: A "rebel" like him would never become a Siegerschau
judge.
Have a nice day! (I've already written more than I ever wanted :-)
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