What do you think of this dog? - Page 8

Blitzen, Vonissk thank you, I know an altered dog is not shown, I had no idea about infertility. It only shows you how much time I spend in the show ring.. not much, enough to get a show rating and on to get a breed survey and that is it.

Again, thanks.

GSDPACK, I don't think you're missing a lot by not participating much in shows. They are fun to watch, but my least favorite dog activity in which to participate.

I don't want to make this any more complicated than it needs to be, but an altered dog can be shown at an AKC independent specialty show in the Veterans class and in the working dog class when it is offered. Not sure about SV rules. It wouldn't surprise me to learn one day that AKC has managed to generate some sort of special class for altered dogs at all breed shows.  Maybe a Not-For-Breeding AKC CH designation

Can we all agree on two premises:
1  The point of Showing dogs is not to win awards (though they are nice to receive), it is to parade the best bloodstock
for the information of the fancy, so that it can be evaluated and seen which dogs and lines are good to use in breeding, for the eventual and ongoing betterment of the breed. (Oh, and have a little fun in the hobby).
2  The German Shepherd Dog is a working dog first and foremost.

Let me declare my own interests here :  I have always believed the GSD in the normal domestic environment should
be a dual purpose dog.  It is preferrable for everyone who owns this breed to give it some kind of a job to do (as much
for its physical & mental health as anything) to the extent of their capabilities;  and it is also their responsibilty to the
breed in general to select - and if they breed, to produce - dogs which are as close to the original Standard as possible.
Maybe it does not get to be a Champion at anything, but it should compete or train both ways.  (Anyone arguing so far ?)

I am currently just the owner of a single GSD, he is nearly 10 years old, he has never been good enough to Show or
breed with, (so I have not inflicted his faults on any pups);  he was however bred as a Showdog, from West German
showlines with a bit of British showlines,  non-'Alsatian' ones, that is.  I have also been employed to care for a variety
of GSDs, some of them serious working dogs, during the past 4 decades.
 
I firmly believe that the perpetrators of the American Showlines "as they have been" down through Lance etc into the
present time, which are a distinct type of dog, [although now undergoing a little change], owe it to the GSD world at
large to present the best and soundest specimens of their favoured type.  To that end, they ought to be at least
lightly worked - which in the main they are apparently not - and they should not continue to chase trophies once it
becomes knwn there is something seriously detrimental about them for the purpose of Showing as outlined above.
I believe the same about UK showdogs.FOR THE SAKE OF THE BREED, not owners and breeders egos.

 

The good news is that far many more GSD's are earning AKC performance titles than championship titles.  In June 2012 18 GSD's completed their championships, 3 their Grand Championships.

OB/performance titles for the same month totaled around 140. AKC does not designate which GSD's are also Champions, but I do recognize some of them as being dual titled.  About 75% of these dogs are ASL's, the rest GSL's and GWL's representing many well known kennels.

 

Hundmutter, I agree with your posts 100%, and there are no reason a dog can't have a title on both ends of name except dogmatic perception of Judges in different places. Is anybody going to tell me that there are only one or twi, maybe no, dogs in all of Germany that is not correct enough to be an American champion. C'mon folks...in the country of origin there aren't any dogs (because these dogs have titles at one end), that are not structurally worthy of Championship status? I mean out of hundreds of thousands of dogs in Europe, and the thousands and thousands of dogs imported, 99%, are not worthy of being a Champion. That is insane! Really!!!! My point is nobody has to show somebody nice dogs with titles at both ends, there are plenty of dogs out there deserving, it just requires a readjustment of the mindset of the judging. One last thing, I get tired of not being objective and being called a basher, case in point....in the last thirty five years the state of working dog sports has increased dramatically in America, while the decline in the American Show dog is at a point that the number of dogs you see in shows is a pittance compared to the past. Maybe not the national events, but look at the entrie and amount needed for points. I took out some old German Shepherd reviews from the seventies, and then got a couple from 2000. The amount of entries in shows across the country today is pathetic compared to what used to be. This is fact!!! At the same time the amount of sch clubs have gone up significantly in the same period. Droves of people have left the American show ring and American show dogs, that's a fact, and any breeder if they're honest knows how often they get an inquiry for puppy with stipulation that they don't want that type with extreme angulation or shyness...and these are just regular people wanting their first dog, not WL people. The point is WL people, or opinions about lines did not create this situation, people that left and went to GSL or to WL, lleft for reasons. People need to take their heads out of their butts and analyze the reasons this dog has lost national and international appeal to have caused such massive defections, and quit blaming others. This is self created, was foreseen, and has come to pass. Ain't nobody's but the leadership of the national breed club. Shoot it got so bad that loyal people within the national club formed an internal organization( WDA), because they wanted to be loyal th the national club, but the dogs advanced by the national club were not capable of fulfilling their aspirations of having a dog to work or compete. This is fact....so these people are national members but look where the overwhelming majority of their dogs come from. Your problem isn't with bashers, though that's a popular scapegoat.....your problem is with what you have created, nobody is buying into it being correct, and then want to be accepted on equal status with the majority of GS breeders in the world. It's not going to happen until the dog moves back to center in important areas.

AKC entries in all breeds are down the proverbial toilet. Not only due to the economy and disinterest, also because AKC in it's infinite wisdom has approved almost 3 times as many shows as there were 30 years ago. The entries are spread out, it only takes a handful of dogs to make a major, there are way too many inferior champions of all breeds in the AKC ring.  It's not just this breed. Some of us finish our dogs and don't special them; instead we train them in performance events and try to dual title them. IMO that is the future of the GSD in the AKC ring.

Blitzen, this is a honest question out of interest, because I´m not used to AKC rules -
what´s the meaning of "performance events" and "dual title" ?
Kind regards,
Susie

Blitzen, in reference to German Shepherds, is what I wrote generally true or a creation of my imagination. I'm just curious....what is the norm. ....not interestedd in exceptions because they don't represent what average person see or does.

Susie, AKC performance events are obedience, agility, rally, tracking, herding, and a few GSD's also particpate in coursing trials.

Which part, Gustav?