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by missbeeb on 15 November 2010 - 13:11
What you breed is what you get!by Silbersee on 17 March 2010 - 16:03 SilberseePosts: 242Joined: Sat Aug 07, 2004 07:30 pm
Hi there Dawn,you are so right!!! Nobody is perfect and no dog is perfect!But Jantie is a perfectionist by nature and if something does not fall into this category, it needs to be eliminated. The oldtimers here all remember Indiana vom Wildsteiger Land!!1) Jantie wanted a GSD, not just some GSD. It had to be from the best kennel in the world. The GSD breeder in his vicinity was not good enough!2) His GSD had to be the nicest and most beautiful one! He had planned his feeding, upbringing and socialization to the "t". We all remember these posts!3) Indiana was diagnosed with HD! Jantie dragged him to specialists. Not to help the dog, but to document his outrage about the perceived fraud which was done to him!4) Here on the PDB, we all pleaded with him to let his dog live. Somebody offered to take him, asked for Indiana to be shipped to her and we would have put up a collection. There would have been no costs for Jantie!5) Yet, he chose to have this beautiful dog killed and dissected (photos under Indiana's picture gallery - unless Jantie deleted them). A lot of people here were sick to their stomach!6) He sued the breeder in court and lost his case! Under German law, you have to prove negligence by the breeder which could have only been done if he could have proven that parents and ancestors had HD and were used for breeding. Of course, all dogs had a-stamps! Yet, Jantie blamed the loss on his legal representation's lack of knowledge/advice!7) Ever since then, he has started his personal vendetta. The breeder could not be touched, so he targets the SV and the GSD in general, as that is what the SV stands for.8)
The only recourse he has is this board. Members of the German boards, show and working people alike do not want to give him the time of the day. These two groupd usually never agree on anything but in Jantie's case they all do! This is his only way of getting attention! Do not give it to him, please! Jantie,I know you will hate it that I bring up these old stories but I have to. You are so full of hatred I feel sorry for you! Can you ever be happy and positive about anything? Chris
Hi there Dawn,you are so right!!! Nobody is perfect and no dog is perfect!But Jantie is a perfectionist by nature and if something does not fall into this category, it needs to be eliminated. The oldtimers here all remember Indiana vom Wildsteiger Land!!1) Jantie wanted a GSD, not just some GSD. It had to be from the best kennel in the world. The GSD breeder in his vicinity was not good enough!2) His GSD had to be the nicest and most beautiful one! He had planned his feeding, upbringing and socialization to the "t". We all remember these posts!3) Indiana was diagnosed with HD! Jantie dragged him to specialists. Not to help the dog, but to document his outrage about the perceived fraud which was done to him!4) Here on the PDB, we all pleaded with him to let his dog live. Somebody offered to take him, asked for Indiana to be shipped to her and we would have put up a collection. There would have been no costs for Jantie!5) Yet, he chose to have this beautiful dog killed and dissected (photos under Indiana's picture gallery - unless Jantie deleted them). A lot of people here were sick to their stomach!6) He sued the breeder in court and lost his case! Under German law, you have to prove negligence by the breeder which could have only been done if he could have proven that parents and ancestors had HD and were used for breeding. Of course, all dogs had a-stamps! Yet, Jantie blamed the loss on his legal representation's lack of knowledge/advice!7) Ever since then, he has started his personal vendetta. The breeder could not be touched, so he targets the SV and the GSD in general, as that is what the SV stands for.8)
The only recourse he has is this board. Members of the German boards, show and working people alike do not want to give him the time of the day. These two groupd usually never agree on anything but in Jantie's case they all do! This is his only way of getting attention! Do not give it to him, please! Jantie,I know you will hate it that I bring up these old stories but I have to. You are so full of hatred I feel sorry for you! Can you ever be happy and positive about anything? Chris
by missbeeb on 15 November 2010 - 13:11
What you breed is what you get!by Silbersee on 18 March 2010 - 01:03 SilberseePosts: 242Joined: Sat Aug 07, 2004 07:30 pm
If you guys can stomach that, please have a look: www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/picturegallery/2642.htmlIf I have to euthanize a beloved dog, I could never imagine having a post mortem done to satisfy my curiosity.Again, this dog had unilateral hip dysplasia, he could have had a hip replacement or a removal of the femur head and lived. In addition, he never showed any discomfort, according to Jantie himself!! Why did he have to be put to sleep? He could have lived as a pet here in the U.S. But Jantie did not want him to! It would not have served his purpose!Here is some more reading material for interested people. I will not comment here anymore because Jantie will certainly come here again with a lengthy post and I will not give him any more attention! He called us "backyard bitches" in one of these reads.www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/bulletins_read/115371.htmlwww.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/bulletins_read/41833.htmlwww.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/bulletins_read/153824.htmlwww.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/bulletins_read/75480.htmlSome older threads have been deleted. There may be more, you can always search the message board for Indiana.Rest in Peace, Indiana! You were not perfection and had the misfortune of being sold to a perfectionist as a puppy!Chris
If you guys can stomach that, please have a look: www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/picturegallery/2642.htmlIf I have to euthanize a beloved dog, I could never imagine having a post mortem done to satisfy my curiosity.Again, this dog had unilateral hip dysplasia, he could have had a hip replacement or a removal of the femur head and lived. In addition, he never showed any discomfort, according to Jantie himself!! Why did he have to be put to sleep? He could have lived as a pet here in the U.S. But Jantie did not want him to! It would not have served his purpose!Here is some more reading material for interested people. I will not comment here anymore because Jantie will certainly come here again with a lengthy post and I will not give him any more attention! He called us "backyard bitches" in one of these reads.www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/bulletins_read/115371.htmlwww.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/bulletins_read/41833.htmlwww.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/bulletins_read/153824.htmlwww.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/bulletins_read/75480.htmlSome older threads have been deleted. There may be more, you can always search the message board for Indiana.Rest in Peace, Indiana! You were not perfection and had the misfortune of being sold to a perfectionist as a puppy!Chris
by missbeeb on 15 November 2010 - 13:11
Sorry if I've messed up with the width of the posts above.
Just wanted you all to know a little of Jantie's story... not a Fairy story, for a change.
by peterlee on 15 November 2010 - 14:11
missbeeb,
Thank you for sharing that with us. I had long realised there is a different reality on Planet Jantie. The more people know that the better I think.
eve127,
'sollen sie doch alle glauben was sie wollen', Yup, I guess that is exactly what people who think the earth is flat say....
Thank you for sharing that with us. I had long realised there is a different reality on Planet Jantie. The more people know that the better I think.
eve127,
'sollen sie doch alle glauben was sie wollen', Yup, I guess that is exactly what people who think the earth is flat say....
by bazza on 15 November 2010 - 18:11
Miss beeb, I remember all the posts and photo's vividly, but as I mentioned in a previous post, Jantie also swore vengence for the death of his dog.
by Jantie on 15 November 2010 - 19:11
The story of Indiana vom Wildsteigerland matches exactly with what happens here with Zara.
Although the dogs both had crippled hips (pictures through my website) when screened by independant Vets, the breeders maneged to call upon the services of SV-Vets and the results are turned upside down overnight!
Although Indiana's hip looked like a Greek ruine, the breeder stated he could arrange to have HIS VET put an A-stamp on the dog, so he could be used for breeding!!
(So much for breeding requirements!)
David Peterlee Perry, you are so full of jokes. Your website is one plea for the SV (obvious why you would feel so under attack, when somebody scrutinizes this organization). And you even want to set up a new club (although you couldn’t find the statutes of the SV)?
Must put some of your quotes here, when you allow me:
“In the UK we have dogs crippled by hip dysplasia (note: do you really now!?) and of uncertain character (oh my God!) because we have no meaningful mandatory breeding requirements. Health can be tested. Fitness can be tested. Character can be tested. Ability to work can be tested. In Germany they do this. In the UK they do not.”
And you still believe the earth is flat!?
Read Eve’s (insider) comment again, and you will see all breeding requirements and tests are a hoax. The mob is controlling who is healthy and who is not, which dogs will run the first places in the show and will be studding their brains out. Hence and forth a moderate hip dysplasia changes overnight in A-normal, and if you don’t cut in a piece for the judge, your stud will never mate again!
If you are so keen on the mandatory German breeding requirements, why did you not have Elbows screened for your own stud dog? Your stud was sired by a dog with bad elbows (c)!
And although his mother had 25 offspring in 5 litters, merely 5 testified normal hips. Question: where are all of the other 20 results? Were they thrown away? Were they so bad? YOU, so keen on full health screening and bragging with the German requirements being so stringent (at least according to your own commercials), have taken in a dog of questionable ancestors? Bad elbows and hardly any HD/ED-screening in the family?
“This matters because many, if not most, German Shepherds seen in the UK are of low qualityand they very often suffer from health and temperament issues.”
This goes for Germany just as well, as insiders keep reporting on different discussion boards.
“Germany is the home of the German Shepherd Dog and its German Shepherds are universally recognised as the best in the world.”
Where have you been? Right now the word goes around that in order to secure a healthy GSD, you have to go and look outside of Germany!! (And away from the overly-used lines of course).
I daresay you want to claim you go by the the breeding requirements of the SV, as you still believe in Santa Claus. The breeding requirements of the SV are NOT sufficient, and manipulations are frequent. Judge Meyer himself has openly testified the SV-Zuchtwert-Programm (Genetics) isn’t working.
If people read your commercials (and they must bring some time), then they have to step away from buying the offspring of Gilbert immediately, as he has not been fully screened according to the German requirements! So you got some more homework to do. Please don’t breed Gilbert, as we now know, the ED-situation might even become a bigger problem than the HD. We’ve only be screening for a while.
BTW, the story of Silbersee (Chris) is a distortion from the truth. Why? Pretty obvious if you know she (like many others - see "Peterlee" araxes) wants a piece of the German cake as well, and shares the contacts and the dogs with SV-judges/breeders. Remember: "Wiens brood men eet
Although the dogs both had crippled hips (pictures through my website) when screened by independant Vets, the breeders maneged to call upon the services of SV-Vets and the results are turned upside down overnight!
Although Indiana's hip looked like a Greek ruine, the breeder stated he could arrange to have HIS VET put an A-stamp on the dog, so he could be used for breeding!!
(So much for breeding requirements!)
David Peterlee Perry, you are so full of jokes. Your website is one plea for the SV (obvious why you would feel so under attack, when somebody scrutinizes this organization). And you even want to set up a new club (although you couldn’t find the statutes of the SV)?
Must put some of your quotes here, when you allow me:
“In the UK we have dogs crippled by hip dysplasia (note: do you really now!?) and of uncertain character (oh my God!) because we have no meaningful mandatory breeding requirements. Health can be tested. Fitness can be tested. Character can be tested. Ability to work can be tested. In Germany they do this. In the UK they do not.”
And you still believe the earth is flat!?
Read Eve’s (insider) comment again, and you will see all breeding requirements and tests are a hoax. The mob is controlling who is healthy and who is not, which dogs will run the first places in the show and will be studding their brains out. Hence and forth a moderate hip dysplasia changes overnight in A-normal, and if you don’t cut in a piece for the judge, your stud will never mate again!
If you are so keen on the mandatory German breeding requirements, why did you not have Elbows screened for your own stud dog? Your stud was sired by a dog with bad elbows (c)!
And although his mother had 25 offspring in 5 litters, merely 5 testified normal hips. Question: where are all of the other 20 results? Were they thrown away? Were they so bad? YOU, so keen on full health screening and bragging with the German requirements being so stringent (at least according to your own commercials), have taken in a dog of questionable ancestors? Bad elbows and hardly any HD/ED-screening in the family?
“This matters because many, if not most, German Shepherds seen in the UK are of low qualityand they very often suffer from health and temperament issues.”
This goes for Germany just as well, as insiders keep reporting on different discussion boards.
“Germany is the home of the German Shepherd Dog and its German Shepherds are universally recognised as the best in the world.”
Where have you been? Right now the word goes around that in order to secure a healthy GSD, you have to go and look outside of Germany!! (And away from the overly-used lines of course).
I daresay you want to claim you go by the the breeding requirements of the SV, as you still believe in Santa Claus. The breeding requirements of the SV are NOT sufficient, and manipulations are frequent. Judge Meyer himself has openly testified the SV-Zuchtwert-Programm (Genetics) isn’t working.
If people read your commercials (and they must bring some time), then they have to step away from buying the offspring of Gilbert immediately, as he has not been fully screened according to the German requirements! So you got some more homework to do. Please don’t breed Gilbert, as we now know, the ED-situation might even become a bigger problem than the HD. We’ve only be screening for a while.
BTW, the story of Silbersee (Chris) is a distortion from the truth. Why? Pretty obvious if you know she (like many others - see "Peterlee" araxes) wants a piece of the German cake as well, and shares the contacts and the dogs with SV-judges/breeders. Remember: "Wiens brood men eet
by Jantie on 15 November 2010 - 19:11
Sorry, the end here:
"Wiens brood men eet, diens woord men spreekt!"
D: Wes Brot ich ess, dess Lied ich sing!
E: He who pays the piper, calls the tune!
"Wiens brood men eet, diens woord men spreekt!"
D: Wes Brot ich ess, dess Lied ich sing!
E: He who pays the piper, calls the tune!
by Silbersee on 15 November 2010 - 21:11
Jantie,
who do you think you are to come here and accuse me of being in it with the German judges?
1) I am German, I do not need a piece of the German cake.
2) I am not a commercial or even big hobby breeder.
3) I breed showline and workingline litters, or even mix them - not a very popular choice by either group. Plus, I am neither involved in showing nor competitive trialing.
4) Where have I distorted the truth? Everything is very well documented here.
You cry foul when you get attacked here but freely dish out accusations against others and call it fact finding or being out to find the truth. What kind of twisted mind do you have?
As I have stated previously (thanks missbeeb for finding it), you come here as your only venue to spew venom. The German boards would not entertain any of it, and you know it.
They would tell you that they respect Prof. Dr. Bernd Telhelm, who also happens to be the evaluator for other breeds and for the RSV-2000, and is not in the pockets of the SV, as you were trying to make it appear. It is common knowledge that Prof. Dr. Bernd Telhelm is very strict, more so than others. He is the 2nd evaluator for HD and the first of ED for the SV. If he evaluated the dog as in between a-normal and a-NZ, it is what it is. What personal vendetta do you have against Christoph Ludwig and why does he have to prove anything to you? Who the hell are you to demand that? Go back and continue with your blog of distorted truths self promotion.
You hope to come here and find some newbies who will listen to you until they look at old posts or get educated by us oldtimers on who you really are.
I am waiting and I dare you to go to the German boards to start this crap. Maybe, somebody will finally take you to court and stop you.Your hatred is self destructing - eventually! Do yourself a favor and find a different breed!
who do you think you are to come here and accuse me of being in it with the German judges?
1) I am German, I do not need a piece of the German cake.
2) I am not a commercial or even big hobby breeder.
3) I breed showline and workingline litters, or even mix them - not a very popular choice by either group. Plus, I am neither involved in showing nor competitive trialing.
4) Where have I distorted the truth? Everything is very well documented here.
You cry foul when you get attacked here but freely dish out accusations against others and call it fact finding or being out to find the truth. What kind of twisted mind do you have?
As I have stated previously (thanks missbeeb for finding it), you come here as your only venue to spew venom. The German boards would not entertain any of it, and you know it.
They would tell you that they respect Prof. Dr. Bernd Telhelm, who also happens to be the evaluator for other breeds and for the RSV-2000, and is not in the pockets of the SV, as you were trying to make it appear. It is common knowledge that Prof. Dr. Bernd Telhelm is very strict, more so than others. He is the 2nd evaluator for HD and the first of ED for the SV. If he evaluated the dog as in between a-normal and a-NZ, it is what it is. What personal vendetta do you have against Christoph Ludwig and why does he have to prove anything to you? Who the hell are you to demand that? Go back and continue with your blog of distorted truths self promotion.
You hope to come here and find some newbies who will listen to you until they look at old posts or get educated by us oldtimers on who you really are.
I am waiting and I dare you to go to the German boards to start this crap. Maybe, somebody will finally take you to court and stop you.Your hatred is self destructing - eventually! Do yourself a favor and find a different breed!
by Silbersee on 15 November 2010 - 21:11
P.S. BTW, things like this story are not uncommon with females. We had a female who received a-noch zugelassen in Germany, OFA-GOOD (prelim as she was only 15 months old) and it was the same x-ray. The original was sent to Germany, the copy to OFA. We complaied to the SV who offered us a second opinion with a different x-ray. We took the offer and had the dog re-xrayed in Germany a couple of months later and she was evaluated as a-fast normal.
Another time, a female who was right before her season was evaluated as OFA-borderline. The owner protested and re-xrayed her as well 4 months later and received OFA-Good. That was an old fellow club member of ours in the early 90s.
Fluctuating female hormone levels cause lax joints - common knowledge among breeders and vets.
Another time, a female who was right before her season was evaluated as OFA-borderline. The owner protested and re-xrayed her as well 4 months later and received OFA-Good. That was an old fellow club member of ours in the early 90s.
Fluctuating female hormone levels cause lax joints - common knowledge among breeders and vets.
by missbeeb on 15 November 2010 - 22:11
Chris, Sincere apologies for getting you dragged in to this drivel... that was never my intention, I only wanted to highlight Jantie's "problems" and you made it so clear in your posts.
Babs
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