Serious hard GSD - Page 2

A truly hard and civil dog isn’t as safe in public as many people want to believe they are. These dogs NEED training in order to teach them to control some of their urges. A hard dog, doesn’t take corrections well and is very hard to train. So a dog that NEEDS training and yet isn’t very biddable to accept the training is a problem when in the hands of someone who doesn’t know what they’re doing or is 100% committed to training the dog. These dogs react to perceived threats with aggression and need to be taught what a real threat is because many things they might see “out in the world” might be perceived as a threat to them when it really isn’t. That’s when those dogs get in trouble.

Btw…your sexist commentary…I’m fairly certain everyone that’s commented on this thread is a male, not that it matters.

"(preferably male)" ? Dog? Because female dogs are quite capable of being both hard and civil, concurrently.

'Careful what you wish for ' is referring to people not understanding what a Hard and civil dog really is and therefore not able to adequately handle such dog. A person who must ask what constitutes a 'hard and civil' dog should probably not wish for one. jmo

 

Ps. Mith, per your 'sexist remark', this isn't the dark ages anymore....are you calling * your* female "....an attention seeking slut." ? 

They stil exist I know a GSD breeder in Holland who have some fine studs and females

I don,t put the kennel name here the last time I did this on a forum some people
accused me for comercial promotions so I don,t put it on www anymore.

The problem is to find a match with people who can handle this dogs so maybe
the dogs get softer but handlers also.

The last super hard malinois I have to match with a good experience handler
cost me 4 months and even than it get be wrong...............
Everybody wish superhard civil etc but to find a real good match who can control them that is an art.( even by LE/ Police departments)

Super hard civil wil not say this dogs are always not in balance and are idiots.
Some of this dog can switch very easy from 0 to 100.

 

Agree with Duke every body has his own intrepetation what is hard or hard.
 

 

 

"Be careful what you wish for."

Meaning, it takes a lot of training to teach the dog to tolerate things that a more social dog naturally does. When you are in public, no matter how much training the dog has, you always have to keep a close eye on the dog and look for crazy people who want to dart out and hug your dog. You can't leave the dog alone with guests or he will trap your guests in their chairs until you come back into the room. It means spending a lot of time teaching the dog to tolerate a physical exam (on your command) from the vet. It means being fair and very clear in your training because the dog will muzzle punch you in the nuts if you aren't. At least, that's my experience with my husband's dog. :)


 

@bavarian I totally agree with you lol when I mean hard dogs I don't mean a dog that's handler aggressive necessarily but a dog whose truly agressive, ( teeth out , foaming and doesn't care for sleeves ) when confronted or when his territory or handler is threatened , yes I've seen dogs that pretend that they defend the handler but again most of them still look at it as a game and they've just been dogs who have been transitioned from the sleeve to suits or hidden sleeves , the dog doesn't have the intention to want to fuck you up really , to put it frankly.
I've been to 5 different sch clubs and other venues and not once have I seen anything that's serious and yes I've seen ipo3 dogs that couldn't defend a Junk yard and I understand that's not what they want at the clubs or breedbut my point is why has the true civil drive and agression has been bred out of GSD wih maybe a few exceptions in in Eastern Europe still that i know of. I love Gsds but I  feel like breeders should stop breeding for dogs that track hot dogs in grass or howl for tennis balls and really go back to what a solid GSD was bred for , like the old DDR dogs 

Canisa Bismack in Iasi , Romania produces hard and civil dogs.

Those dogs you are talking about Shawnicus are dogs the majority of the "buying" GSD owners either do not want or cannot handle properly. Those type dogs are usually not safe in the public and can easily get themselves into public trouble. If you were talking about military/police work absolutely those people could handle such a dog; general public absolutely NOT bred for the average handler/family/even competition. The general public is what buys the current GSD's; probably a very large percentage of the GSD's sold are not to the military and law enforcement. Plus those type "hard" dogs or civil dogs are a hugh liability for the owners/handlers. Would also depend on who has trained the "hard" dog(s) and you are not taking into consideration that the GSD bred today needs to be a versatile dog worthy of mastering any job given to them. Good luck, Nan

LOL black malinois, really curious who in holland has severall strong males and females as I dont know anyone in holland that does, neither in KNPV and in IPO, several who have one , yes

Duke, what about Koos ? There is a Max V Tiekerhook son ( PSA 3 ) and he is considered to be on of the best PSA dogs in USA; don't recall his name now , but can find out if need be.

Mithuna, don´t read this post, I am still a woman!!!

I am a fan of "serious hard" gsdogs, but...

people who know how to handle this kind of dogs don´t tend to make a big deal out of them, their dogs are well trained, a spectator normally won´t recognize them
whereas
people who don´t know anything about training and temperament tend to describe the inacceptable behavior of their mentally disturbed pet as "serious" and "hard".

During the years I had to learn that the more owners tend to brag about their dog the more problems there are.
The "real" owners of "real" dogs tend to train.